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The Budget Battle - Large and Small
Author: BobR
Date: 07/20/2011 12:40:20
The ongoing debt ceiling battle will apparently run right up to the wire. We have less than a week before economaggedon, and the partisan posturing is more apparent then ever. Finally there is movement beyond talking, but the most recent movement has more in common with bowel than budgetary reality.
Last night, the Republicans passed a bill in the House that would raise the debt ceiling, but only if accompanied by $6T in cuts in Federal spending, and the floating of a Constitutional amendment to require a balanced budget. The vote - largely along party lines - was essentially symbolic, as the bill stands no chance in the Senate, and has been promised a veto by President Obama:
However, there IS a bi-partisan compromise proposal being considered as well, that is NOT symbolic. Put forth by the so-called "Gang of Six", the proposal has been praised by President Obama:
Obviously, the Tea Party wing of the Republican party is not going to like "additional revenue", but they may be outnumbered by the realists in both parties. Naturally, progressive alarmists will read "tackling health care spending, and entitlements in a serious way", and start blathering about "cuts to Social Security and Medicare" without pausing to consider that the programs can be made more efficient without cutting benefits.
The alternative is to consider Minnesota. They've been without a government for 3 weeks. They finally approved a budget yesterday, and - mirroring what will ultimately have to happen at the federal level - no one was happy:
Yes - compromise. That is what governing is all about - the art of the deal. Absolutism has no place in higher office.
Last night, the Republicans passed a bill in the House that would raise the debt ceiling, but only if accompanied by $6T in cuts in Federal spending, and the floating of a Constitutional amendment to require a balanced budget. The vote - largely along party lines - was essentially symbolic, as the bill stands no chance in the Senate, and has been promised a veto by President Obama:
Defying a veto threat, the Republican-controlled House voted Tuesday night to slice federal spending by $6 trillion and require a constitutional balanced budget amendment to be sent to the states in exchange for averting a threatened Aug. 2 government default.
The 234-190 vote marked the power of deeply conservative first-term Republicans, and it stood in contrast to calls at the White House and in the Senate for a late stab at bipartisanship to solve the nation's looming debt crisis.
However, there IS a bi-partisan compromise proposal being considered as well, that is NOT symbolic. Put forth by the so-called "Gang of Six", the proposal has been praised by President Obama:
"The good news is that today, a group of senators, the gang of six, Democrats and Republicans... put forward a proposal that is broadly consistent with the approach that I've urged," Obama told reporters at the White House.
He said that under that new approach "we've got to be serious about reducing discretionary spending, both in domestic spending and defense, we've got to be serious about tackling health care spending, and entitlements in a serious way, and we've got to have some additional revenue.
"So that we have an approach in which there is shared sacrifice and everybody is giving up something."
Obviously, the Tea Party wing of the Republican party is not going to like "additional revenue", but they may be outnumbered by the realists in both parties. Naturally, progressive alarmists will read "tackling health care spending, and entitlements in a serious way", and start blathering about "cuts to Social Security and Medicare" without pausing to consider that the programs can be made more efficient without cutting benefits.
The alternative is to consider Minnesota. They've been without a government for 3 weeks. They finally approved a budget yesterday, and - mirroring what will ultimately have to happen at the federal level - no one was happy:
"While the budget agreement was not the most ideal to anyone, it was time to compromise, end the shutdown and put Minnesota back to work," Republican Deputy Majority Leader Geoff Michel said afterward in a statement.
The governor and legislative leaders had announced a tentative deal on Thursday, then worked out the details of what was estimated by nonpartisan staff at about $34.3 billion of spending for the fiscal years 2012 and 2013.
All three have said they were unhappy with the plan but believed they must support the compromise. It stripped out tax increases Dayton had sought as well as some social policy changes Republicans wanted. It also had higher spending levels than Republicans were seeking.
Yes - compromise. That is what governing is all about - the art of the deal. Absolutism has no place in higher office.
Comments:
Order comments Newest to Oldest Refresh Comments
Comment by 
Scoopster on 07/20/2011 12:53:44
Scoopster on 07/20/2011 12:53:44
Mornin' all. 
Time for a power stretch! RAAAAWR!
Time for a power stretch! RAAAAWR!
Comment by 
BobR on 07/20/2011 12:57:49
BobR on 07/20/2011 12:57:49
The blog is up.
Comment by 
Mondobubba on 07/20/2011 12:58:58
Mondobubba on 07/20/2011 12:58:58
Morning mon peeps.
Comment by Scoopster on 07/20/2011 13:02:18
Scoopster on 07/20/2011 13:02:18
btw, are Republicans stupid or somethin'? You need 2/3 majority to pass a constitutional amendment, so this bill they "passed" really didn't pass shit.
Comment by BobR on 07/20/2011 13:08:15
BobR on 07/20/2011 13:08:15
Comment by Mondobubba on 07/20/2011 13:09:00
It is all about them going back to their districts and being able to say they stood up for America against Barak HoosanLeninStalinHilterMaoPolPot Obama's socialistcommunistfascist tyranny. Their fearful pig ignorant constituants will eat that shit up with a spoon. I full expect to get a missive from my useless congress critter about this very issue.
Mondobubba on 07/20/2011 13:09:00
Quote by Scoopster:
btw, are Republicans stupid or somethin'? You need 2/3 majority to pass a constitutional amendment, so this bill they "passed" really didn't pass shit.
It is all about them going back to their districts and being able to say they stood up for America against Barak HoosanLeninStalinHilterMaoPolPot Obama's socialistcommunistfascist tyranny. Their fearful pig ignorant constituants will eat that shit up with a spoon. I full expect to get a missive from my useless congress critter about this very issue.
Comment by BobR on 07/20/2011 13:09:28
I think the bill means that a separate Constitutional Amendment will be floated and voted on separately. Of course - if it makes it out of the house, it will be lucky, and is sure to die in the Senate.
BobR on 07/20/2011 13:09:28
Quote by Scoopster:
btw, are Republicans stupid or somethin'? You need 2/3 majority to pass a constitutional amendment, so this bill they "passed" really didn't pass shit.
I think the bill means that a separate Constitutional Amendment will be floated and voted on separately. Of course - if it makes it out of the house, it will be lucky, and is sure to die in the Senate.
Comment by Mondobubba on 07/20/2011 13:10:12
Oh I'm sure the loathsome Jack Kingston (R-GA 4) has already done this.
Mondobubba on 07/20/2011 13:10:12
Quote by Mondobubba:Quote by Scoopster:
btw, are Republicans stupid or somethin'? You need 2/3 majority to pass a constitutional amendment, so this bill they "passed" really didn't pass shit.
It is all about them going back to their districts and being able to say they stood up for America against Barak HoosanLeninStalinHilterMaoPolPot Obama's socialistcommunistfascist tyranny. Their fearful pig ignorant constituants will eat that shit up with a spoon. I full expect to get a missive from my useless congress critter about this very issue.
Oh I'm sure the loathsome Jack Kingston (R-GA 4) has already done this.
Comment by 
Raine on 07/20/2011 13:10:40
good morning!
Raine on 07/20/2011 13:10:40
good morning!
Comment by Scoopster on 07/20/2011 13:16:40
Scoopster on 07/20/2011 13:16:40
Comment by 
TriSec on 07/20/2011 13:19:15
TriSec on 07/20/2011 13:19:15
Greetings, comrades.
Do we still have the bank of fainting couches set up with the coffee IV racks?
Clorpenaramine Maleate...there is a reason the dose is only 1 pill.
<-- again.
Do we still have the bank of fainting couches set up with the coffee IV racks?
Clorpenaramine Maleate...there is a reason the dose is only 1 pill.
<-- again.
Comment by Raine on 07/20/2011 13:19:23
Raine on 07/20/2011 13:19:23
The House has essentially passed an unpassable bill. More stalling and obstruction.
Comment by 
wickedpam on 07/20/2011 13:21:07
wickedpam on 07/20/2011 13:21:07
Morning 
Okay has anyone seen a new politcal ad for calling congress that refered to hearing Obama speak he was basically well spoken but they now regret their vote? I caught a glimpse last night, thought it was on CBS during NCIS I wasn't really paying attention, I was talking to a neighbor
Okay has anyone seen a new politcal ad for calling congress that refered to hearing Obama speak he was basically well spoken but they now regret their vote? I caught a glimpse last night, thought it was on CBS during NCIS I wasn't really paying attention, I was talking to a neighbor
Comment by TriSec on 07/20/2011 13:23:20
TriSec on 07/20/2011 13:23:20
Wrapping up a loose thread from yesterday...
(pilot-in-command) Al Haynes and (training captain) Denny Fitch managed to use asymmetric thrust to put a crippled trike (DC-10) on final approach to Sioux City Gateway and gave everyone a chance, which is more than what they had when #2 blew up at cruising altitude and took out all the hydraulics.
Anyway...
(pilot-in-command) Al Haynes and (training captain) Denny Fitch managed to use asymmetric thrust to put a crippled trike (DC-10) on final approach to Sioux City Gateway and gave everyone a chance, which is more than what they had when #2 blew up at cruising altitude and took out all the hydraulics.
Anyway...
Comment by Scoopster on 07/20/2011 13:27:01
Scoopster on 07/20/2011 13:27:01
More special election results...
WI Dem. State Senator easily turns back recall effort by the Teadiots.
There were two other recall primaries on the R side, the winners of which will move on to general recall elections against Dem incumbents on Aug 16. The batch of six recall challenges to Republican incumbents will happen on Aug 9.
WI Dem. State Senator easily turns back recall effort by the Teadiots.
There were two other recall primaries on the R side, the winners of which will move on to general recall elections against Dem incumbents on Aug 16. The batch of six recall challenges to Republican incumbents will happen on Aug 9.
Comment by Will in Chicago on 07/20/2011 13:27:30
Good morning, bloggers!! I hope all is well. I am checking in quickly before running some job hunting related errands.
I think that Minnesota shows us what could go wrong if the debt ceiling is not raised. Perhaps we will see a solution before we get that bad, but I would not like to see Minnesota's woes writ large on the nation. We might end up with a full Depression. (If the GOP is blamed, I would advise Obama to try to make his last term like FDR's first too and not care what the GOP thinks -- if thinking is the appropriate verb here.)
Will in Chicago on 07/20/2011 13:27:30
Good morning, bloggers!! I hope all is well. I am checking in quickly before running some job hunting related errands.
I think that Minnesota shows us what could go wrong if the debt ceiling is not raised. Perhaps we will see a solution before we get that bad, but I would not like to see Minnesota's woes writ large on the nation. We might end up with a full Depression. (If the GOP is blamed, I would advise Obama to try to make his last term like FDR's first too and not care what the GOP thinks -- if thinking is the appropriate verb here.)
Comment by Raine on 07/20/2011 13:27:51
Was it the one w/ a woman putting her daughter to bed?
I really have to start writing down the names of these groups.
Raine on 07/20/2011 13:27:51
Quote by wickedpam:
Morning
Okay has anyone seen a new politcal ad for calling congress that refered to hearing Obama speak he was basically well spoken but they now regret their vote? I caught a glimpse last night, thought it was on CBS during NCIS I wasn't really paying attention, I was talking to a neighbor
I really have to start writing down the names of these groups.
Comment by Mondobubba on 07/20/2011 13:28:23
You could have said Clortrimeatron and we would have understood you
Mondobubba on 07/20/2011 13:28:23
Quote by TriSec:
Greetings, comrades.
Do we still have the bank of fainting couches set up with the coffee IV racks?
Clorpenaramine Maleate...there is a reason the dose is only 1 pill.
:Thud: <-- again.
You could have said Clortrimeatron and we would have understood you
Comment by wickedpam on 07/20/2011 13:32:05
I think so, I saw someone get out or going to bed out of the corner of my eye.
wickedpam on 07/20/2011 13:32:05
Quote by Raine:Was it the one w/ a woman putting her daughter to bed?Quote by wickedpam:
Morning
Okay has anyone seen a new politcal ad for calling congress that refered to hearing Obama speak he was basically well spoken but they now regret their vote? I caught a glimpse last night, thought it was on CBS during NCIS I wasn't really paying attention, I was talking to a neighbor
I really have to start writing down the names of these groups.
I think so, I saw someone get out or going to bed out of the corner of my eye.
Comment by Raine on 07/20/2011 13:34:37
yeah -- that one is particularly awful. It's the one where it says we need to stop obama's blank check.
Raine on 07/20/2011 13:34:37
Quote by wickedpam:Quote by Raine:Was it the one w/ a woman putting her daughter to bed?Quote by wickedpam:
Morning
Okay has anyone seen a new politcal ad for calling congress that refered to hearing Obama speak he was basically well spoken but they now regret their vote? I caught a glimpse last night, thought it was on CBS during NCIS I wasn't really paying attention, I was talking to a neighbor
I really have to start writing down the names of these groups.
I think so, I saw someone get out or going to bed out of the corner of my eye.
Comment by Raine on 07/20/2011 13:39:07
Raine on 07/20/2011 13:39:07
Allen West is the worst bagger of the Day, even worse than Eric Cantor:
From: Z112 West, Allen
Sent: Tuesday, July 19, 2011 04:48 PM
To: Wasserman Schultz, Debbie
Cc: McCarthy, Kevin; Blyth, Jonathan; Pelosi, Nancy; Cantor, Eric
Subject: Unprofessional and Inappropriate Sophomoric Behavior from Wasserman-Schultz
Look, Debbie, I understand that after I departed the House floor you directed your floor speech comments directly towards me. Let me make myself perfectly clear, you want a personal fight, I am happy to oblige. You are the most vile, unprofessional ,and despicable member of the US House of Representatives. If you have something to say to me, stop being a coward and say it to my face, otherwise, shut the heck up. Focus on your own congressional district!
I am bringing your actions today to our Majority Leader and Majority Whip and from this time forward, understand that I shall defend myself forthright against your heinous characterless behavior……which dates back to the disgusting protest you ordered at my campaign hqs, October 2010 in Deerfield Beach.
You have proven repeatedly that you are not a Lady, therefore, shall not be afforded due respect from me!
Steadfast and Loyal
Congressman Allen B West (R-FL)
Comment by Scoopster on 07/20/2011 13:41:25
Scoopster on 07/20/2011 13:41:25
Jeez.. what a dickhead.
Comment by wickedpam on 07/20/2011 13:42:44
Thats it! Blank check.
Just that little flash I saw was horrify! I mean really, it sounded just horribly racist, basically saying "he speaks well"
wickedpam on 07/20/2011 13:42:44
Quote by Raine:yeah -- that one is particularly awful. It's the one where it says we need to stop obama's blank check.Quote by wickedpam:Quote by Raine:Was it the one w/ a woman putting her daughter to bed?Quote by wickedpam:
Morning
Okay has anyone seen a new politcal ad for calling congress that refered to hearing Obama speak he was basically well spoken but they now regret their vote? I caught a glimpse last night, thought it was on CBS during NCIS I wasn't really paying attention, I was talking to a neighbor
I really have to start writing down the names of these groups.
I think so, I saw someone get out or going to bed out of the corner of my eye.
Thats it! Blank check.
Just that little flash I saw was horrify! I mean really, it sounded just horribly racist, basically saying "he speaks well"
Comment by Mondobubba on 07/20/2011 13:44:25
Alan West is a massive tool. He always has been. he is the go-to GOPer for "The Teaparty isn't racist, Alan West is one of us!" comments.
Mondobubba on 07/20/2011 13:44:25
Quote by Raine:
Allen West is the worst bagger of the Day, even worse than Eric Cantor:From: Z112 West, Allen
Sent: Tuesday, July 19, 2011 04:48 PM
To: Wasserman Schultz, Debbie
Cc: McCarthy, Kevin; Blyth, Jonathan; Pelosi, Nancy; Cantor, Eric
Subject: Unprofessional and Inappropriate Sophomoric Behavior from Wasserman-Schultz
Look, Debbie, I understand that after I departed the House floor you directed your floor speech comments directly towards me. Let me make myself perfectly clear, you want a personal fight, I am happy to oblige. You are the most vile, unprofessional ,and despicable member of the US House of Representatives. If you have something to say to me, stop being a coward and say it to my face, otherwise, shut the heck up. Focus on your own congressional district!
I am bringing your actions today to our Majority Leader and Majority Whip and from this time forward, understand that I shall defend myself forthright against your heinous characterless behavior……which dates back to the disgusting protest you ordered at my campaign hqs, October 2010 in Deerfield Beach.
You have proven repeatedly that you are not a Lady, therefore, shall not be afforded due respect from me!
Steadfast and Loyal
Congressman Allen B West (R-FL)
Alan West is a massive tool. He always has been. he is the go-to GOPer for "The Teaparty isn't racist, Alan West is one of us!" comments.
Comment by wickedpam on 07/20/2011 13:44:48
OMG, I'd read the story but not the letter! He sounds just like my troll-like problem child neighbor
wickedpam on 07/20/2011 13:44:48
Quote by Raine:
Allen West is the worst bagger of the Day, even worse than Eric Cantor:From: Z112 West, Allen
Sent: Tuesday, July 19, 2011 04:48 PM
To: Wasserman Schultz, Debbie
Cc: McCarthy, Kevin; Blyth, Jonathan; Pelosi, Nancy; Cantor, Eric
Subject: Unprofessional and Inappropriate Sophomoric Behavior from Wasserman-Schultz
Look, Debbie, I understand that after I departed the House floor you directed your floor speech comments directly towards me. Let me make myself perfectly clear, you want a personal fight, I am happy to oblige. You are the most vile, unprofessional ,and despicable member of the US House of Representatives. If you have something to say to me, stop being a coward and say it to my face, otherwise, shut the heck up. Focus on your own congressional district!
I am bringing your actions today to our Majority Leader and Majority Whip and from this time forward, understand that I shall defend myself forthright against your heinous characterless behavior……which dates back to the disgusting protest you ordered at my campaign hqs, October 2010 in Deerfield Beach.
You have proven repeatedly that you are not a Lady, therefore, shall not be afforded due respect from me!
Steadfast and Loyal
Congressman Allen B West (R-FL)
OMG, I'd read the story but not the letter! He sounds just like my troll-like problem child neighbor
Comment by BobR on 07/20/2011 13:48:02
This should be resolved soon, because ... well - you know why if you read the blog.
BobR on 07/20/2011 13:48:02
This should be resolved soon, because ... well - you know why if you read the blog.
Comment by Raine on 07/20/2011 13:48:33
Raine on 07/20/2011 13:48:33
He's a nasty bully. I saw the video. It was nothing out of the norm. I guess I shouldn't expect more from a man who was kicked out of the military the way he was.
Comment by 
velveeta jones on 07/20/2011 13:55:21
Morning all!
What an ASSHAT. Wow. "boo-hoooooo"
velveeta jones on 07/20/2011 13:55:21
Quote by Mondobubba:Quote by Raine:
Allen West is the worst bagger of the Day, even worse than Eric Cantor:From: Z112 West, Allen
Sent: Tuesday, July 19, 2011 04:48 PM
To: Wasserman Schultz, Debbie
Cc: McCarthy, Kevin; Blyth, Jonathan; Pelosi, Nancy; Cantor, Eric
Subject: Unprofessional and Inappropriate Sophomoric Behavior from Wasserman-Schultz
Look, Debbie, I understand that after I departed the House floor you directed your floor speech comments directly towards me. Let me make myself perfectly clear, you want a personal fight, I am happy to oblige. You are the most vile, unprofessional ,and despicable member of the US House of Representatives. If you have something to say to me, stop being a coward and say it to my face, otherwise, shut the heck up. Focus on your own congressional district!
I am bringing your actions today to our Majority Leader and Majority Whip and from this time forward, understand that I shall defend myself forthright against your heinous characterless behavior……which dates back to the disgusting protest you ordered at my campaign hqs, October 2010 in Deerfield Beach.
You have proven repeatedly that you are not a Lady, therefore, shall not be afforded due respect from me!
Steadfast and Loyal
Congressman Allen B West (R-FL)
Alan West is a massive tool. He always has been. he is the go-to GOPer for "The Teaparty isn't racist, Alan West is one of us!" comments.
Morning all!
What an ASSHAT. Wow. "boo-hoooooo"
Comment by Mondobubba on 07/20/2011 14:00:43
Mondobubba on 07/20/2011 14:00:43
Raine, we needs to tweet Olbermann and nominate West as a Worst Person.
Comment by wickedpam on 07/20/2011 14:11:14
wickedpam on 07/20/2011 14:11:14
great now I have Marcus Bachmann singing Defying Gravity stuck in my head!!!!! ARGH!
Comment by Mondobubba on 07/20/2011 14:15:26
Mondobubba on 07/20/2011 14:15:26
Comment by wickedpam on 07/20/2011 14:16:25
wickedpam on 07/20/2011 14:16:25
This guy must have been listening to the guy who sat in for Bill Press this morning - the callers were calling the Pres the "Betrayer" and that Dante 9th CIrcle of Hell was reserved for people like Judas.
This is getting out of hand
This is getting out of hand
Comment by Raine on 07/20/2011 14:16:47
That what I am trying to understand at this point. Seriously? the IRA???? that is SOOO 80's.
Raine on 07/20/2011 14:16:47
Quote by Mondobubba:Quote by Raine:
O'keefe Strikes again.
Yet people take this asshat seriously.
Comment by Raine on 07/20/2011 14:17:10
Firebaggers.
Raine on 07/20/2011 14:17:10
Quote by wickedpam:
This guy must have been listening to the guy who sat in for Bill Press this morning - the callers were calling the Pres the "Betrayer" and that Dante 9th CIrcle of Hell was reserved for people like Judas.
This is getting out of hand
Comment by Raine on 07/20/2011 14:24:08
Raine on 07/20/2011 14:24:08
How great would it be for Michael Moore to Punk O'keefe ala TV Nation or The Awful truth?
Comment by wickedpam on 07/20/2011 14:27:39
I'd watch that
wickedpam on 07/20/2011 14:27:39
Quote by Raine:
How great would it be for Michael Moore to Punk O'keefe ala TV Nation or The Awful truth?
I'd watch that
Comment by wickedpam on 07/20/2011 14:28:39
wickedpam on 07/20/2011 14:28:39
That's a t-shirt -
GOP working to make Lemon Pledge a food group.
GOP working to make Lemon Pledge a food group.
Comment by Mondobubba on 07/20/2011 14:30:36
Why don't the managers of these organizations send out a memo that says if an outlandisly dressed clown shows with an amazingly bullshit story tell them to fuck off O'Keefe lackey! Then have a outsized, glowering security guard throw them out?
Mondobubba on 07/20/2011 14:30:36
Quote by Raine:That what I am trying to understand at this point. Seriously? the IRA???? that is SOOO 80's.Quote by Mondobubba:Quote by Raine:
O'keefe Strikes again.
Yet people take this asshat seriously.
Why don't the managers of these organizations send out a memo that says if an outlandisly dressed clown shows with an amazingly bullshit story tell them to fuck off O'Keefe lackey! Then have a outsized, glowering security guard throw them out?
Comment by BobR on 07/20/2011 14:37:09
Seriously - send his photo to every gov agency that might be targeted by him, with instructions on how to get him to say the wrong things that could land him in jail
BobR on 07/20/2011 14:37:09
Quote by Mondobubba:Quote by Raine:That what I am trying to understand at this point. Seriously? the IRA???? that is SOOO 80's.Quote by Mondobubba:Quote by Raine:
O'keefe Strikes again.
Yet people take this asshat seriously.
Why don't the managers of these organizations send out a memo that says if an outlandisly dressed clown shows with an amazingly bullshit story tell them to fuck off O'Keefe lackey! Then have a outsized, glowering security guard throw them out?
Seriously - send his photo to every gov agency that might be targeted by him, with instructions on how to get him to say the wrong things that could land him in jail
Comment by TriSec on 07/20/2011 14:45:39
TriSec on 07/20/2011 14:45:39
Say Raine, has that garden of yours gained sentience yet? I have "Cukezilla" about to take over the rest of my plants up here.
Comment by velveeta jones on 07/20/2011 14:47:35
velveeta jones on 07/20/2011 14:47:35
The IRA is wearing kilts these days? Wow. They must be going through some sort of Madonna 80's craze? Weird....
Comment by Raine on 07/20/2011 14:53:54
My cukes and tomatoes are creating a new plant species.
It's scary, to be honest. I have 15 pounds of Tomatoes in the freezer --- once I get to 25 pounds, we get to canning *gravy*
I'm still trying to figure out which pickles to make from the 20+ cukes I have waiting.
Raine on 07/20/2011 14:53:54
Quote by TriSec:
Say Raine, has that garden of yours gained sentience yet? I have "Cukezilla" about to take over the rest of my plants up here.
It's scary, to be honest. I have 15 pounds of Tomatoes in the freezer --- once I get to 25 pounds, we get to canning *gravy*
I'm still trying to figure out which pickles to make from the 20+ cukes I have waiting.
Comment by Raine on 07/20/2011 14:54:31
Who the hell admits they are from the IRA?
It's almost like admitting you are a pimp.
Raine on 07/20/2011 14:54:31
Quote by velveeta jones:
The IRA is wearing kilts these days? Wow. They must be going through some sort of Madonna 80's craze? Weird....
It's almost like admitting you are a pimp.
Comment by TriSec on 07/20/2011 14:55:49
TriSec on 07/20/2011 14:55:49
Houston, we have an asschub.
Comment by wickedpam on 07/20/2011 14:57:09
do you just get regular pickling spices?
wickedpam on 07/20/2011 14:57:09
Quote by Raine:My cukes and tomatoes are creating a new plant species.Quote by TriSec:
Say Raine, has that garden of yours gained sentience yet? I have "Cukezilla" about to take over the rest of my plants up here.
It's scary, to be honest. I have 15 pounds of Tomatoes in the freezer --- once I get to 25 pounds, we get to canning *gravy*
I'm still trying to figure out which pickles to make from the 20+ cukes I have waiting.
do you just get regular pickling spices?
Comment by Raine on 07/20/2011 14:59:16
Raine on 07/20/2011 14:59:16
Actaully, I would agree with Jay Rosen from NYU:
FOR this and this alone, yes, I would agree that if prosecuted, They should be labeled as such. They are not news. They are a lobbying arm of the company -- and the GOP uses them as much.
News Corp. isn't a news company, but a global media empire that employs its newspapers (and Fox News) as a lobbying arm.
Comment by TriSec on 07/20/2011 15:01:40
TriSec on 07/20/2011 15:01:40
Coincidence that the shuttle is up for the last time on the anniversary of this?
Further reinforcing my opinion that this represented America's High Point. Now we have no meaningful space program, either.
Further reinforcing my opinion that this represented America's High Point. Now we have no meaningful space program, either.
Comment by Raine on 07/20/2011 15:04:54
Mr. Rosen wrote this article to accompany this tweet.
Raine on 07/20/2011 15:04:54
Quote by Raine:
Actaully, I would agree with Jay Rosen from NYU:FOR this and this alone, yes, I would agree that if prosecuted, They should be labeled as such. They are not news. They are a lobbying arm of the company -- and the GOP uses them as much.News Corp. isn't a news company, but a global media empire that employs its newspapers (and Fox News) as a lobbying arm.
Comment by velveeta jones on 07/20/2011 15:15:35
velveeta jones on 07/20/2011 15:15:35
Hey everyone. When the shuttle lands, everyone in the world should dress up in Ape costumes.
Comment by Raine on 07/20/2011 15:17:00
I don't know that I agree with you on that. Tri. Dr. Maddow had this as one of the best things.
The shuttle is over, but things are happening. There has been real talk about making sure we put people back in space. How long was it before the space shuttle that we put people back in space? Our Space program is meaningful, just because we aren't putting people up there doesn't mean we aren't working on great things.
We are going back to the moon. We will go back to the ISS.
Raine on 07/20/2011 15:17:00
Quote by TriSec:
Coincidence that the shuttle is up for the last time on the anniversary of this?
Further reinforcing my opinion that this represented America's High Point. Now we have no meaningful space program, either.
The shuttle is over, but things are happening. There has been real talk about making sure we put people back in space. How long was it before the space shuttle that we put people back in space? Our Space program is meaningful, just because we aren't putting people up there doesn't mean we aren't working on great things.
We are going back to the moon. We will go back to the ISS.
Comment by wickedpam on 07/20/2011 15:23:16
Quick someone bury the Statue of LIbery up to her chest!
wickedpam on 07/20/2011 15:23:16
Quote by velveeta jones:
Hey everyone. When the shuttle lands, everyone in the world should dress up in Ape costumes.
Quick someone bury the Statue of LIbery up to her chest!
Comment by TriSec on 07/20/2011 15:23:42
TriSec on 07/20/2011 15:23:42
Skylab in 73-74, then Apollo/Soyuz in 1975.
Followed by a 6-year break, so point taken for now.
Followed by a 6-year break, so point taken for now.
Comment by Raine on 07/20/2011 15:31:10
I would love to see people back in space, but I think that programs like the Mars programs are really important.
look at how much we learned from Hubble.
Raine on 07/20/2011 15:31:10
Quote by TriSec:
Skylab in 73-74, then Apollo/Soyuz in 1975.
Followed by a 6-year break, so point taken for now.
look at how much we learned from Hubble.
Comment by Raine on 07/20/2011 15:33:17
LOL!
Raine on 07/20/2011 15:33:17
Quote by wickedpam:Quote by velveeta jones:
Hey everyone. When the shuttle lands, everyone in the world should dress up in Ape costumes.
Quick someone bury the Statue of LIbery up to her chest!
LOL!
Comment by TriSec on 07/20/2011 15:34:40
TriSec on 07/20/2011 15:34:40
Automated and Remote programs are cool for the geeky types....but there needs to be bodies there to capture 'the masses'.
I dunno; the political climate is so different, I'm not getting the warm fuzzies this time around. The shuttle program was well underway when Apollo 18 touched down; we don't even have a replacement in the pipeline this time. Not even the prospect of China beating us back to the moon has inspired any kind of new effort for manned spaceflight.
Sure feels like the end of an era.
I dunno; the political climate is so different, I'm not getting the warm fuzzies this time around. The shuttle program was well underway when Apollo 18 touched down; we don't even have a replacement in the pipeline this time. Not even the prospect of China beating us back to the moon has inspired any kind of new effort for manned spaceflight.
Sure feels like the end of an era.
Comment by Raine on 07/20/2011 16:06:23
Raine on 07/20/2011 16:06:23
It took China until 2004 to put a man in space.
I'm not really worried about them. I do believe that it should have to take people in space to prove that NASA is doing good things. Many people laughed at Bush for wanting to do so. Many are laughing at Obama for wanting to put a man on an asteroid. In the mean time, I really believe that NASA should not be in the business of appeasing the masses, although I do understand what you are saying, Tri.
I would far prefer NASA to concentrate on science, in the most efficient way. The space race was once about putting a man on the moon -- then it changed into a wonderful space taxi . Reusable spaceships.
It's time, IMO to move onto the next big thing. Going to Mars or an asteroid is it -- and it is simply going to take a long time, considering how long it will take to get there. I would not assume that program has not been underway for a long time. Mars is a lot farther away than the moon. It's not like NASA isn't trying:
I'm not really worried about them. I do believe that it should have to take people in space to prove that NASA is doing good things. Many people laughed at Bush for wanting to do so. Many are laughing at Obama for wanting to put a man on an asteroid. In the mean time, I really believe that NASA should not be in the business of appeasing the masses, although I do understand what you are saying, Tri.
I would far prefer NASA to concentrate on science, in the most efficient way. The space race was once about putting a man on the moon -- then it changed into a wonderful space taxi . Reusable spaceships.
It's time, IMO to move onto the next big thing. Going to Mars or an asteroid is it -- and it is simply going to take a long time, considering how long it will take to get there. I would not assume that program has not been underway for a long time. Mars is a lot farther away than the moon. It's not like NASA isn't trying:
"In that decade not only will we fully utilize the International Space Station but we will develop the capabilities to send humans up and down through the commercial crew program and to send humans beyond low Earth orbit with the space launch system and the multipurpose crew vehicle," he said.
"What specific year in that decade I think does depend a lot on budgets but I am pretty comfortable with it in that timeframe."
NASA told Congress in January that it could not afford to build a new heavy lift rocket and space capsule within the five-year timeframe and budget outlined in the fiscal year 2011 and President Barack Obama's 2012 budget request.
"None of the design options studied thus far appeared to be affordable in our present fiscal conditions, based upon existing cost models, historical data, and traditional acquisition approaches," said a NASA report to lawmakers.
Comment by Mondobubba on 07/20/2011 16:09:15
Mondobubba on 07/20/2011 16:09:15
Wow! This is a minor hoot. From Wikipedia: "Felix Dzerzhinsky, Soviet law enforcement official" That is wonderfully understated. He was the head of the dreaded Checka, the first iteration of the KGB.
Comment by Mondobubba on 07/20/2011 16:11:16
Hey don't forget one of the other goals of the space race was proving the USSR we could build bigger, more accurate boosters for ICBMs than they could.
Mondobubba on 07/20/2011 16:11:16
Quote by Raine:
It took China until 2004 to put a man in space.
I'm not really worried about them. I do believe that it should have to take people in space to prove that NASA is doing good things. Many people laughed at Bush for wanting to do so. Many are laughing at Obama for wanting to put a man on an asteroid. In the mean time, I really believe that NASA should not be in the business of appeasing the masses, although I do understand what you are saying, Tri.
I would far prefer NASA to concentrate on science, in the most efficient way. The space race was once about putting a man on the moon -- then it changed into a wonderful space taxi . Reusable spaceships.
It's time, IMO to move onto the next big thing. Going to Mars or an asteroid is it -- and it is simply going to take a long time, considering how long it will take to get there. I would not assume that program has not been underway for a long time. Mars is a lot farther away than the moon. It's not like NASA isn't trying:"In that decade not only will we fully utilize the International Space Station but we will develop the capabilities to send humans up and down through the commercial crew program and to send humans beyond low Earth orbit with the space launch system and the multipurpose crew vehicle," he said.
"What specific year in that decade I think does depend a lot on budgets but I am pretty comfortable with it in that timeframe."
NASA told Congress in January that it could not afford to build a new heavy lift rocket and space capsule within the five-year timeframe and budget outlined in the fiscal year 2011 and President Barack Obama's 2012 budget request.
"None of the design options studied thus far appeared to be affordable in our present fiscal conditions, based upon existing cost models, historical data, and traditional acquisition approaches," said a NASA report to lawmakers.
Hey don't forget one of the other goals of the space race was proving the USSR we could build bigger, more accurate boosters for ICBMs than they could.
Comment by 
livingonli on 07/20/2011 16:13:12
livingonli on 07/20/2011 16:13:12
Good day everyone. I have an eye doctor's appointment today and if I need new glasses as I get older and may need a reading adjustment and my glasses are not cheap.
Comment by Raine on 07/20/2011 16:16:25
Raine on 07/20/2011 16:16:25
I'd like to believe we've gotten out of that nasty Titan business with the USSR, Mondo. I believe Bush and Putin put it to an end.
Comment by livingonli on 07/20/2011 16:21:09
livingonli on 07/20/2011 16:21:09
I commented when someone else posted the Allan West comment on their facebook page. He does seem to have issues with women who disagree with him a la Debbie Wasserman-Schultz or Nicole Sandler
Comment by Mondobubba on 07/20/2011 16:23:31
Clean up on asile two!
Mondobubba on 07/20/2011 16:23:31
Quote by Raine:
I'd like to believe we've gotten out of that nasty Titan business with the USSR, Mondo. I believe Bush and Putin put it to an end.
Clean up on asile two!
Comment by Mondobubba on 07/20/2011 16:24:40
Liv, might I suggest you look into Eyebuydirect.com
Mondobubba on 07/20/2011 16:24:40
Quote by livingonli:
Good day everyone. I have an eye doctor's appointment today and if I need new glasses as I get older and may need a reading adjustment and my glasses are not cheap.
Liv, might I suggest you look into Eyebuydirect.com
Comment by BobR on 07/20/2011 16:24:51
NASA decided they'd "been there, done that" wrt to providing bus service to the space station, and they're relegating that to private hands. Unmanned space flight is much more cost-effective for science research, which is really what it's all about. The idea of robotic cars on Mars sending back amazing video is certainly a thrill for me.
I would certainly love to see manned space flight again outside of earth orbit, but the cost/benefit is hard to justify. On the other hand - watching private companies take up the ball and provide manned transport to earth orbit will certainly be thrilling too.
BobR on 07/20/2011 16:24:51
Quote by TriSec:
Automated and Remote programs are cool for the geeky types....but there needs to be bodies there to capture 'the masses'.
I dunno; the political climate is so different, I'm not getting the warm fuzzies this time around. The shuttle program was well underway when Apollo 18 touched down; we don't even have a replacement in the pipeline this time. Not even the prospect of China beating us back to the moon has inspired any kind of new effort for manned spaceflight.
Sure feels like the end of an era.
NASA decided they'd "been there, done that" wrt to providing bus service to the space station, and they're relegating that to private hands. Unmanned space flight is much more cost-effective for science research, which is really what it's all about. The idea of robotic cars on Mars sending back amazing video is certainly a thrill for me.
I would certainly love to see manned space flight again outside of earth orbit, but the cost/benefit is hard to justify. On the other hand - watching private companies take up the ball and provide manned transport to earth orbit will certainly be thrilling too.
Comment by Mondobubba on 07/20/2011 16:26:59
Oh that is not what I talking about. All that automation and computer guidance stuff from Apollo went right into ICBMs.
Mondobubba on 07/20/2011 16:26:59
Quote by Raine:
I'd like to believe we've gotten out of that nasty Titan business with the USSR, Mondo. I believe Bush and Putin put it to an end.
Oh that is not what I talking about. All that automation and computer guidance stuff from Apollo went right into ICBMs.
Comment by Mondobubba on 07/20/2011 16:29:29
Mondobubba on 07/20/2011 16:29:29
Today in history: Bubba & Hilary have Vince Foster whacked.
Comment by TriSec on 07/20/2011 17:41:30
TriSec on 07/20/2011 17:41:30
I need a 5-hour energy today. But since I dont' have one, maybe I'll try some blow.
Nah, copious amounts of caffeine, coming up!
Lahj regulah --->
Nah, copious amounts of caffeine, coming up!
Lahj regulah --->
Comment by Mondobubba on 07/20/2011 17:43:38
Mondobubba on 07/20/2011 17:43:38
Comment by Mondobubba on 07/20/2011 17:44:23
Was the DD right next to a CVS?
Mondobubba on 07/20/2011 17:44:23
Quote by TriSec:
I need a 5-hour energy today. But since I dont' have one, maybe I'll try some blow.
Nah, copious amounts of caffeine, coming up!
Lahj regulah --->
Was the DD right next to a CVS?
Comment by TriSec on 07/20/2011 17:59:48
It's New England. Of course they are!
TriSec on 07/20/2011 17:59:48
Quote by Mondobubba:
Was the DD right next to a CVS?
It's New England. Of course they are!
Comment by Scoopster on 07/20/2011 18:02:45
Scoopster on 07/20/2011 18:02:45
Comment by Raine on 07/20/2011 18:16:53
Raine on 07/20/2011 18:16:53
This caller gives me a headache on Thom. 5 dems in the house are MORE to him than 3 dems in the senate.
Comment by wickedpam on 07/20/2011 18:18:53
not listening - is it more people saying they were betrayed?
wickedpam on 07/20/2011 18:18:53
Quote by Raine:
This caller gives me a headache on Thom. 5 dems in the house are MORE to him than 3 dems in the senate.
not listening - is it more people saying they were betrayed?
Comment by Mondobubba on 07/20/2011 18:33:29
Mondobubba on 07/20/2011 18:33:29
Really Alertnet? Another snarky article about Ayn Rand? How two years ago of you!
Comment by Raine on 07/20/2011 19:02:46
No, it was a conservative saying that the fact the 5 dems voted for Cap crap and cave (or whatever the House bill is) proves that 5 dems are more than the 3 in the senate working on plan b are more important. (numerically)
Raine on 07/20/2011 19:02:46
Quote by wickedpam:Quote by Raine:
This caller gives me a headache on Thom. 5 dems in the house are MORE to him than 3 dems in the senate.
not listening - is it more people saying they were betrayed?
Comment by TriSec on 07/20/2011 19:08:09
TriSec on 07/20/2011 19:08:09
Here we go...just had the briefest of pressers with WCAC (Waltham). Tomorrow night they're running a feature on all the candidates for local office, so I got my bio in and ready to go.
Comment by wickedpam on 07/20/2011 19:11:05
which dems? Cause I'm already not happy with Warner working on this gang of whatever crap
wickedpam on 07/20/2011 19:11:05
Quote by Raine:No, it was a conservative saying that the fact the 5 dems voted for Cap crap and cave (or whatever the House bill is) proves that 5 dems are more than the 3 in the senate working on plan b are more important. (numerically)Quote by wickedpam:Quote by Raine:
This caller gives me a headache on Thom. 5 dems in the house are MORE to him than 3 dems in the senate.
not listening - is it more people saying they were betrayed?
which dems? Cause I'm already not happy with Warner working on this gang of whatever crap
Comment by Scoopster on 07/20/2011 19:14:01
Scoopster on 07/20/2011 19:14:01
Today's Poll on Politico: Will Michele Bachmann's acknowledgment that she suffers from migraines be an issue in her White House bid?
Errrm.. Nah. Migraines are the smallest of problems that worry me about that woman's head.
Errrm.. Nah. Migraines are the smallest of problems that worry me about that woman's head.
Comment by Raine on 07/20/2011 19:28:04
I have had a bit of disappointment with AlterNet as of late. I saw that come across my twitter feed this morning and sorta thought the same thing.
This however really disappointed me. I think they don't they have very good social media management over there. Calling followers Assholes is not a really cool thing.
Raine on 07/20/2011 19:28:04
Quote by Mondobubba:
Really Alertnet? Another snarky article about Ayn Rand? How two years ago of you!
This however really disappointed me. I think they don't they have very good social media management over there. Calling followers Assholes is not a really cool thing.
Comment by Raine on 07/20/2011 19:28:35
Raine on 07/20/2011 19:28:35
SO HAPPY that Randi is talking about the Allen West Email.
Comment by TriSec on 07/20/2011 19:34:14
TriSec on 07/20/2011 19:34:14
Well, unless Ms. Bachmann comes up with her long-form migraine prescription, I say she's fair game.
Comment by Mondobubba on 07/20/2011 19:57:33
The migraines, all part of her tertiary syphilis. Just sayin...
Mondobubba on 07/20/2011 19:57:33
Quote by Scoopster:
Today's Poll on Politico: Will Michele Bachmann's acknowledgment that she suffers from migraines be an issue in her White House bid?
Errrm.. Nah. Migraines are the smallest of problems that worry me about that woman's head.
The migraines, all part of her tertiary syphilis. Just sayin...
Comment by Raine on 07/20/2011 19:58:36
Raine on 07/20/2011 19:58:36
Quote by TriSec:
Well, unless Ms. Bachmann comes up with her long-form migraine prescription, I say she's fair game.
Comment by Mondobubba on 07/20/2011 21:06:47
For me it runs a little deeper. They have a incrediably inconsistent editorial policy. One day some aggresive atheist, the next a lets all spiritual new ager. Don't even get me started on the Oprahesque health section.
Mondobubba on 07/20/2011 21:06:47
Quote by Raine:I have had a bit of disappointment with AlterNet as of late. I saw that come across my twitter feed this morning and sorta thought the same thing.Quote by Mondobubba:
Really Alertnet? Another snarky article about Ayn Rand? How two years ago of you!
This however really disappointed me. I think they don't they have very good social media management over there. Calling followers Assholes is not a really cool thing.
For me it runs a little deeper. They have a incrediably inconsistent editorial policy. One day some aggresive atheist, the next a lets all spiritual new ager. Don't even get me started on the Oprahesque health section.
Comment by Raine on 07/21/2011 00:56:07
agreed. I think you nailed the very problem.
Raine on 07/21/2011 00:56:07
Quote by Mondobubba:Quote by Raine:I have had a bit of disappointment with AlterNet as of late. I saw that come across my twitter feed this morning and sorta thought the same thing.Quote by Mondobubba:
Really Alertnet? Another snarky article about Ayn Rand? How two years ago of you!
This however really disappointed me. I think they don't they have very good social media management over there. Calling followers Assholes is not a really cool thing.
For me it runs a little deeper. They have a incrediably inconsistent editorial policy. One day some aggresive atheist, the next a lets all spiritual new ager. Don't even get me started on the Oprahesque health section.