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The Bidening
Author: BobR
Date: 10/12/2012 12:54:32
There was a lot of pressure on both candidates heading into last night's vice-presidential debate. Ryan need to appear presidential. Biden needed to purge the ghosts of the previous presidential debate. Knowing Joe, it promised to be a lively debate, and it certainly did not disappoint.
It was apparent into Ryan's first answer that Joe wasn't holding anything back. Where Ryan was attempting to maintain a steeley facade, Biden was the definition of animated. From smiles and laughs to exasperated gapes, he was rarely still. He also occassionally interrupted Ryan when Ryan told a particularly aggregious whopper.
The moderator - Martha Raddatz - was unfortunately part of the action too. She inserted her own opinions into the questions asking things like (referring to the attacks on the Libyan embassy): "Wasn't that an Intelligence breakdown?", rather than a more neutral "Do you think there was an Intelligence breakdown?" or "How do you think Intelligence played into the attacks?" To be fair, she also asked Ryan (when he was talking about his budget proposals) "Do you actually have the specifics, or are you still working on it?"
There weren't a lot of pre-packaged zingers, although there were some memorable lines:
Biden: "With all due respect, that's a bunch of malarkey"
Ryan: "I think the vice president knows, sometimes the words don't always come out of your mouth the way you want."
Biden (in response): "But I always say what I mean"
Biden: "Oh, now you're Jack Kennedy"
(the aforementioned) Raddatz: "Do you actually have the specifics, or are you still working on it?"
Based on what I was seeing online as the debate progressed, whether you think Biden was great or was rude broke down squarely along party lines. What the middle-of-the-road and/or undecideds think is less clear, but will likely show up in the polls in a few days. There will be discussions on the body language of the two, but I think the takeaway is that with Biden - what you see is what you get; there was no phoniness. Ryan kept his jaw tight, but you could see anger and frustration in his eyes, and his cheeks were flushing.
In the end, it's likely no one on the right or left had their mind changed by the debate. Hopefully, those in the middle realize which party is looking out for the best interests of the entire country, and which party supports their party platform in private, runs from it in public, and talks a good game on numbers, but can't produce them when asked.
It was apparent into Ryan's first answer that Joe wasn't holding anything back. Where Ryan was attempting to maintain a steeley facade, Biden was the definition of animated. From smiles and laughs to exasperated gapes, he was rarely still. He also occassionally interrupted Ryan when Ryan told a particularly aggregious whopper.
The moderator - Martha Raddatz - was unfortunately part of the action too. She inserted her own opinions into the questions asking things like (referring to the attacks on the Libyan embassy): "Wasn't that an Intelligence breakdown?", rather than a more neutral "Do you think there was an Intelligence breakdown?" or "How do you think Intelligence played into the attacks?" To be fair, she also asked Ryan (when he was talking about his budget proposals) "Do you actually have the specifics, or are you still working on it?"
There weren't a lot of pre-packaged zingers, although there were some memorable lines:
Biden: "With all due respect, that's a bunch of malarkey"
Ryan: "I think the vice president knows, sometimes the words don't always come out of your mouth the way you want."
Biden (in response): "But I always say what I mean"
Biden: "Oh, now you're Jack Kennedy"
(the aforementioned) Raddatz: "Do you actually have the specifics, or are you still working on it?"
Based on what I was seeing online as the debate progressed, whether you think Biden was great or was rude broke down squarely along party lines. What the middle-of-the-road and/or undecideds think is less clear, but will likely show up in the polls in a few days. There will be discussions on the body language of the two, but I think the takeaway is that with Biden - what you see is what you get; there was no phoniness. Ryan kept his jaw tight, but you could see anger and frustration in his eyes, and his cheeks were flushing.
In the end, it's likely no one on the right or left had their mind changed by the debate. Hopefully, those in the middle realize which party is looking out for the best interests of the entire country, and which party supports their party platform in private, runs from it in public, and talks a good game on numbers, but can't produce them when asked.
Comments:
Order comments Newest to Oldest Refresh Comments
Comment by 
Scoopster on 10/12/2012 13:08:42
Scoopster on 10/12/2012 13:08:42
First! 
Mornin' all & Happy Fridee!! 
It's probably gonna take me all weekend to write that blog post Bobber, so if you guys have something already done go for it.
Mornin' all & Happy Fridee!! It's probably gonna take me all weekend to write that blog post Bobber, so if you guys have something already done go for it.
Comment by Scoopster on 10/12/2012 13:11:24
Scoopster on 10/12/2012 13:11:24
Also, I'm catching up on last night's debate this morning while I work.
The VERY FIRST THING out of Ryan's mouth is an outright lie. Obama didn't call the thing in Libya a coordinated terrorist attack right away because WE DIDN'T HAVE PROOF THAT IT WAS ONE!
The VERY FIRST THING out of Ryan's mouth is an outright lie. Obama didn't call the thing in Libya a coordinated terrorist attack right away because WE DIDN'T HAVE PROOF THAT IT WAS ONE!
Comment by 
TriSec on 10/12/2012 13:11:27
TriSec on 10/12/2012 13:11:27
Greetings, comrades!
Ditching my pump in a few hours - that's halfway!
Ditching my pump in a few hours - that's halfway!
Comment by 
Mondobubba on 10/12/2012 13:16:56
Mondobubba on 10/12/2012 13:16:56
Morning! Boy, I'd hate to be Paul Ryan's cut man. Ouch!
Poor little Eddit Munster.
Poor little Eddit Munster.
Comment by Scoopster on 10/12/2012 13:19:58
Scoopster on 10/12/2012 13:19:58
Just keep beating that damn Iran war drum, P90-X.
And now the LIE about Obama blowing off Netanyahu again.
And now the LIE about Obama blowing off Netanyahu again.
Comment by 
BobR on 10/12/2012 13:23:21
BobR on 10/12/2012 13:23:21
Blog is posted
Comment by BobR on 10/12/2012 13:24:02
w00t!
BobR on 10/12/2012 13:24:02
Quote by TriSec:
Greetings, comrades!
Ditching my pump in a few hours - that's halfway!
w00t!
Comment by TriSec on 10/12/2012 13:24:56
TriSec on 10/12/2012 13:24:56
There's some asschub action to check out...
Comment by Scoopster on 10/12/2012 13:36:38
Scoopster on 10/12/2012 13:36:38
One party control when Obama came into office? BULLSHIT.
What was the timeframe between the time Al Franken FINALLY was seated in the Senate and Scott Brown won the special election in MA? A month? Two?
What was passed during that short timeframe when we actually had 60 votes to break a filibuster? The MINOR NON-BUDGETARY FIXES to the Affordable Care Act. EVERYTHING ELSE before or after that, from legislation to help the economy to executive and judicial appointments, either got filibustered into oblivion or had to be watered down to the point where one of the few partially sane GOP senators would cross the aisle.
What was the timeframe between the time Al Franken FINALLY was seated in the Senate and Scott Brown won the special election in MA? A month? Two?
What was passed during that short timeframe when we actually had 60 votes to break a filibuster? The MINOR NON-BUDGETARY FIXES to the Affordable Care Act. EVERYTHING ELSE before or after that, from legislation to help the economy to executive and judicial appointments, either got filibustered into oblivion or had to be watered down to the point where one of the few partially sane GOP senators would cross the aisle.
Comment by Mondobubba on 10/12/2012 13:38:10
Mondobubba on 10/12/2012 13:38:10
Spoiler alter, Scoop! my favorite debate moment was about an hour in when JB went all goggle-eyed at something Ryan said. The look was very much one of What the FUCK are you talking about, Eddie Munster?
Comment by 
trojanrabbit on 10/12/2012 13:46:41
trojanrabbit on 10/12/2012 13:46:41
So the same people who beat their chests and crowed that Romney "beat" Obama are whining that Mean Old Joe beat up on poor defenseless Eddie....
1. As Obama IS the President, I expect him to act "presidential". I have no expectation for a Republican to act as anything other than a sniveling, whining, lying Republican, no matter what office he's running for.
2. I see the VP position partially as being the President's "bulldog". I have no expectation of Biden (or Ryan) to act "Presidential". Sure, Biden stammered a bit, but he had to deal with massive amounts of bullshit spewing from Ryan.
Maybe poor defenseless Eddie should sic Spot on Biden.
1. As Obama IS the President, I expect him to act "presidential". I have no expectation for a Republican to act as anything other than a sniveling, whining, lying Republican, no matter what office he's running for.
2. I see the VP position partially as being the President's "bulldog". I have no expectation of Biden (or Ryan) to act "Presidential". Sure, Biden stammered a bit, but he had to deal with massive amounts of bullshit spewing from Ryan.
Maybe poor defenseless Eddie should sic Spot on Biden.
Comment by Mondobubba on 10/12/2012 13:53:41
I know, right. That is the dumbest GOP talking point ever!
Mondobubba on 10/12/2012 13:53:41
Quote by Scoopster:
One party control when Obama came into office? BULLSHIT.
What was the timeframe between the time Al Franken FINALLY was seated in the Senate and Scott Brown won the special election in MA? A month? Two?
What was passed during that short timeframe when we actually had 60 votes to break a filibuster? The MINOR NON-BUDGETARY FIXES to the Affordable Care Act. EVERYTHING ELSE before or after that, from legislation to help the economy to executive and judicial appointments, either got filibustered into oblivion or had to be watered down to the point where one of the few partially sane GOP senators would cross the aisle.
I know, right. That is the dumbest GOP talking point ever!
Comment by TriSec on 10/12/2012 13:53:54
TriSec on 10/12/2012 13:53:54
I listened to a significant portion of this on the radio last night.
Without visuals, Biden was going all King Arthur on the Black Knight.
Without visuals, Biden was going all King Arthur on the Black Knight.
Comment by trojanrabbit on 10/12/2012 13:57:36
Let's not forget Blow Dog DINOs like Nelson.
trojanrabbit on 10/12/2012 13:57:36
Quote by Mondobubba:Quote by Scoopster:
One party control when Obama came into office? BULLSHIT.
What was the timeframe between the time Al Franken FINALLY was seated in the Senate and Scott Brown won the special election in MA? A month? Two?
What was passed during that short timeframe when we actually had 60 votes to break a filibuster? The MINOR NON-BUDGETARY FIXES to the Affordable Care Act. EVERYTHING ELSE before or after that, from legislation to help the economy to executive and judicial appointments, either got filibustered into oblivion or had to be watered down to the point where one of the few partially sane GOP senators would cross the aisle.
I know, right. That is the dumbest GOP talking point ever!
Let's not forget Blow Dog DINOs like Nelson.
Comment by Scoopster on 10/12/2012 13:58:03
Biden really just said "If Romney did just a good job as governor in MA why isn't he even contesting there?"
Scoopster on 10/12/2012 13:58:03
Biden really just said "If Romney did just a good job as governor in MA why isn't he even contesting there?"
Comment by trojanrabbit on 10/12/2012 14:04:16
Yes he did.
Of course, Ryan had no response for that.
We in MA know how Rmoney would "govern". No tax hikes, but lots of fee hikes.
Whenever he was out of state, he would bash us. Now he thinks he can claim he's responsible for our being #1 in education.
And Willard was so downtrodden and poor he had to live in his son's basement.
trojanrabbit on 10/12/2012 14:04:16
Quote by Scoopster:
Biden really just said "If Romney did just a good job as governor in MA why isn't he even contesting there?"
Yes he did.
Of course, Ryan had no response for that.
We in MA know how Rmoney would "govern". No tax hikes, but lots of fee hikes.
Whenever he was out of state, he would bash us. Now he thinks he can claim he's responsible for our being #1 in education.
And Willard was so downtrodden and poor he had to live in his son's basement.
Comment by TriSec on 10/12/2012 14:12:52
That's the one thing that pissed me off about him. He couldn't even be a gracious host when the Dems came here in '04. Dude, you hate the state so much, why are you in charge, then?
TriSec on 10/12/2012 14:12:52
Quote by trojanrabbit:
Whenever he was out of state, he would bash us. Now he thinks he can claim he's responsible for our being #1 in education.
That's the one thing that pissed me off about him. He couldn't even be a gracious host when the Dems came here in '04. Dude, you hate the state so much, why are you in charge, then?
Comment by 
Raine on 10/12/2012 14:13:03
Raine on 10/12/2012 14:13:03
Good Morning! 
I slept well from the aftermath I shall *The Bidening*
I slept well from the aftermath I shall *The Bidening*
Comment by BobR on 10/12/2012 14:14:14
BobR on 10/12/2012 14:14:14
Quote by TriSec:
I listened to a significant portion of this on the radio last night.
Without visuals, Biden was going all King Arthur on the Black Knight.
Comment by 
wickedpam on 10/12/2012 14:20:19
wickedpam on 10/12/2012 14:20:19
Morning 
Finally drug my butt out of bed - I love vacation days
Finally drug my butt out of bed - I love vacation days
Comment by TriSec on 10/12/2012 14:25:29
TriSec on 10/12/2012 14:25:29
CANDY CORN!
Love, hate, vomit?
(Disclaimer: I loathe peeps, so there is some leeway here.)
Love, hate, vomit?
(Disclaimer: I loathe peeps, so there is some leeway here.)
Comment by Raine on 10/12/2012 14:27:07
Raine on 10/12/2012 14:27:07
Late last night, (After midnite) MSNBC/NBC Had a group of 8 voters who were self identified as not sure/undecided. After the debate the fellow asked by hand raise if the debate helped them become more informed. All but one raised hands. (guy on the top left)
He then asked if they would vote for Romeny/Ruan. One woman rasied her hand. (lower left seat)
He asked who would vote for Obama/Biden after watching; 5 raised hands.
The other 2 remaining said they wanted to watch the next 2 debates. I thought that was interesting.
He then asked if they would vote for Romeny/Ruan. One woman rasied her hand. (lower left seat)
He asked who would vote for Obama/Biden after watching; 5 raised hands.
The other 2 remaining said they wanted to watch the next 2 debates. I thought that was interesting.
Comment by Mondobubba on 10/12/2012 14:29:43
Tis seasonal. I will get my candy corn on for Halloween only.
Mondobubba on 10/12/2012 14:29:43
Quote by TriSec:
CANDY CORN!
Love, hate, vomit?
(Disclaimer: I loathe peeps, so there is some leeway here.)
Tis seasonal. I will get my candy corn on for Halloween only.
Comment by Scoopster on 10/12/2012 14:36:12
Scoopster on 10/12/2012 14:36:12
LOOOOOOOOOOL HONESTY
I need someone to shop Mr. P90-X onto this picture:
http://images.bluegartr.com/bucket/gallery/d02c2ad547c60d07f1c5aa4865d38cce.jpg
I need someone to shop Mr. P90-X onto this picture:
http://images.bluegartr.com/bucket/gallery/d02c2ad547c60d07f1c5aa4865d38cce.jpg
Comment by Mondobubba on 10/12/2012 14:39:40
Mondobubba on 10/12/2012 14:39:40
Quote by Scoopster:
LOOOOOOOOOOL HONESTY
I need someone to shop Mr. P90-X onto this picture:
http://images.bluegartr.com/bucket/gallery/d02c2ad547c60d07f1c5aa4865d38cce.jpg
Comment by BobR on 10/12/2012 14:48:24
Does it have sugar? Then yes.
BobR on 10/12/2012 14:48:24
Quote by TriSec:
CANDY CORN!
Love, hate, vomit?
(Disclaimer: I loathe peeps, so there is some leeway here.)
Does it have sugar? Then yes.
Comment by Scoopster on 10/12/2012 14:50:32
I used to love candy corn man.. I can't eat it anymore tho it makes me sick.
Tell ya what tho.. I'll trade all my candy corn for all your Reese's cups!
Scoopster on 10/12/2012 14:50:32
Quote by TriSec:
CANDY CORN!
Love, hate, vomit?
(Disclaimer: I loathe peeps, so there is some leeway here.)
I used to love candy corn man.. I can't eat it anymore tho it makes me sick.
Tell ya what tho.. I'll trade all my candy corn for all your Reese's cups!
Comment by wickedpam on 10/12/2012 14:51:33
enjoy - if its made right its only made with honey
wickedpam on 10/12/2012 14:51:33
Quote by TriSec:
CANDY CORN!
Love, hate, vomit?
(Disclaimer: I loathe peeps, so there is some leeway here.)
enjoy - if its made right its only made with honey
Comment by Scoopster on 10/12/2012 14:54:11
Scoopster on 10/12/2012 14:54:11
Okay done with the debate.. jeez what a clobberin'!
Oh yeh I didn't mention it when I heard it, but hooooly shit @ Ryan using a car crash anecdote to score points against Biden! If he just overlooked the fact that Biden's wife & daughter were KILLED in a car crash, it's a huge blunder. If he did it intentionally tho, the guy's a bigger scumbag than we ever thought.
Oh yeh I didn't mention it when I heard it, but hooooly shit @ Ryan using a car crash anecdote to score points against Biden! If he just overlooked the fact that Biden's wife & daughter were KILLED in a car crash, it's a huge blunder. If he did it intentionally tho, the guy's a bigger scumbag than we ever thought.
Comment by Scoopster on 10/12/2012 14:55:08
YES THIS!!! There was a point when they changed from using honey to using corn syrup, and ever since then when I eat the damn things they taste like a chemical factory.
Scoopster on 10/12/2012 14:55:08
Quote by wickedpam:Quote by TriSec:
CANDY CORN!
Love, hate, vomit?
(Disclaimer: I loathe peeps, so there is some leeway here.)
enjoy - if its made right its only made with honey
YES THIS!!! There was a point when they changed from using honey to using corn syrup, and ever since then when I eat the damn things they taste like a chemical factory.
Comment by Mondobubba on 10/12/2012 14:55:34
HFCS counts?
Mondobubba on 10/12/2012 14:55:34
Quote by BobR:Quote by TriSec:
CANDY CORN!
Love, hate, vomit?
(Disclaimer: I loathe peeps, so there is some leeway here.)
Does it have sugar? Then yes.
HFCS counts?
Comment by BobR on 10/12/2012 14:57:45
I think either Kraft or Brachs uses honey (but what ratio to other sugar sources, I don't know). Check the package label.
BobR on 10/12/2012 14:57:45
Quote by Scoopster:Quote by wickedpam:Quote by TriSec:
CANDY CORN!
Love, hate, vomit?
(Disclaimer: I loathe peeps, so there is some leeway here.)
enjoy - if its made right its only made with honey
YES THIS!!! There was a point when they changed from using honey to using corn syrup, and ever since then when I eat the damn things they taste like a chemical factory.
I think either Kraft or Brachs uses honey (but what ratio to other sugar sources, I don't know). Check the package label.
Comment by wickedpam on 10/12/2012 15:02:52
I think its Bach - they put it on the label as a selling point
wickedpam on 10/12/2012 15:02:52
Quote by BobR:Quote by Scoopster:Quote by wickedpam:Quote by TriSec:
CANDY CORN!
Love, hate, vomit?
(Disclaimer: I loathe peeps, so there is some leeway here.)
enjoy - if its made right its only made with honey
YES THIS!!! There was a point when they changed from using honey to using corn syrup, and ever since then when I eat the damn things they taste like a chemical factory.
I think either Kraft or Brachs uses honey (but what ratio to other sugar sources, I don't know). Check the package label.
I think its Bach - they put it on the label as a selling point
Comment by BobR on 10/12/2012 15:03:49
maybe
BobR on 10/12/2012 15:03:49
Quote by Mondobubba:Quote by BobR:Quote by TriSec:
CANDY CORN!
Love, hate, vomit?
(Disclaimer: I loathe peeps, so there is some leeway here.)
Does it have sugar? Then yes.
HFCS counts?
maybe
Comment by TriSec on 10/12/2012 15:03:58
TriSec on 10/12/2012 15:03:58
Brach's:
Sugar, Corn Syrup, Confectioner's Glaze, Salt, Honey, Cocoa Powder, Gelatin, A whole bunch of oils, then colors, and stuff.
Very little Dow Chemical ingredients that I see.
Sugar, Corn Syrup, Confectioner's Glaze, Salt, Honey, Cocoa Powder, Gelatin, A whole bunch of oils, then colors, and stuff.
Very little Dow Chemical ingredients that I see.
Comment by Mondobubba on 10/12/2012 15:05:00
Like I said, I wouldn't want to by Ryan's cut man. Ouch!
As far as the car crash "joke." Well played Mr. Vice President. You were the greater man.
Mondobubba on 10/12/2012 15:05:00
Quote by Scoopster:
Okay done with the debate.. jeez what a clobberin'!
Oh yeh I didn't mention it when I heard it, but hooooly shit @ Ryan using a car crash anecdote to score points against Biden! If he just overlooked the fact that Biden's wife & daughter were KILLED in a car crash, it's a huge blunder. If he did it intentionally tho, the guy's a bigger scumbag than we ever thought.
Like I said, I wouldn't want to by Ryan's cut man. Ouch!
As far as the car crash "joke." Well played Mr. Vice President. You were the greater man.
Comment by Raine on 10/12/2012 15:07:16
Raine on 10/12/2012 15:07:16
It was at this point when I called Privatizing Ryan a pure and clear little prick:
RYAN: Mr. Vice President, I know you’re under a lot of duress to make up for lost ground, but I think people would be better served if we don’t keep interrupting each other.
BIDEN: Well, don’t take all the four minutes then.
Comment by BobR on 10/12/2012 15:07:20
Less honey than salt? That takes some brass ones putting it on the package as a selling point.
BobR on 10/12/2012 15:07:20
Quote by TriSec:
Brach's:
Sugar, Corn Syrup, Confectioner's Glaze, Salt, Honey, Cocoa Powder, Gelatin, A whole bunch of oils, then colors, and stuff.
Very little Dow Chemical ingredients that I see.
Less honey than salt? That takes some brass ones putting it on the package as a selling point.
Comment by Raine on 10/12/2012 15:09:49
Raine on 10/12/2012 15:09:49
BIDEN: The ayatollah sees his economy being crippled. The ayatollah sees that there are 50 percent fewer exports of oil. He sees the currency going into the tank. He sees the economy going into freefall. And he sees the world for the first time totally united in opposition to him getting a nuclear weapon.
Now, with regard to Bibi, who’s been my friend 39 years, the president has met with Bibi a dozen times. He’s spoken to Bibi Netanyahu as much as he’s spoken to anybody. The idea that we’re not — I was in a, just before he went to the U.N., I was in a conference call with the — with the president, with him talking to Bibi for well over an hour, in — in — in stark relief and detail of what was going on.
This is a bunch of stuff. Look, here's the deal.
RADDATZ: What does that mean, a bunch of stuff?
BIDEN: Well, it means it's simply inaccurate.
RYAN: It's Irish.
BIDEN: It - it is.
(laughter)
We Irish call it malarkey.
RADDATZ: Thanks for the translation. OK.
Comment by TriSec on 10/12/2012 15:12:11
Give the bees a break. Most of 'em are dead, don'tcha know?
TriSec on 10/12/2012 15:12:11
Quote by BobR:
Less honey than salt? That takes some brass ones putting it on the package as a selling point.
Give the bees a break. Most of 'em are dead, don'tcha know?
Comment by Raine on 10/12/2012 15:17:21
Scoop do you remember about where in the debate that was (I am trying to read the transcript.)
Raine on 10/12/2012 15:17:21
Quote by Scoopster:
Okay done with the debate.. jeez what a clobberin'!
Oh yeh I didn't mention it when I heard it, but hooooly shit @ Ryan using a car crash anecdote to score points against Biden! If he just overlooked the fact that Biden's wife & daughter were KILLED in a car crash, it's a huge blunder. If he did it intentionally tho, the guy's a bigger scumbag than we ever thought.
Scoop do you remember about where in the debate that was (I am trying to read the transcript.)
Comment by Raine on 10/12/2012 15:22:46
Raine on 10/12/2012 15:22:46
THIS was a classic Exchange:
BIDEN: That's not what they said.
RYAN: 7.4 million seniors are projected to lose their current Medicare Advantage coverage they have. That's a $3,200 benefit cut.
BIDEN: That didn't happen.
RYAN: What we're saying...
BIDEN: More people signed up.
RYAN: These are from your own actuaries.
BIDEN: More – more – more people signed up for Medicare Advantage after the change.
RYAN: What – there's...
BIDEN: Nobody...
(CROSSTALK)
RYAN: Mr. Vice President, I know...
BIDEN: No, this is...
(CROSSTALK)
RYAN: Mr. Vice President, I know you're under a lot of duress to make up for lost ground, but I think people would be better served if we don't keep interrupting each other.
BIDEN: Well, don't take all the four minutes then.
RYAN: Let me just – let me just say this. We are not–we're saying don't change benefits for people 55 and above. They already organized their retirement around these promises.
(CROSSTALK)
RYAN: ... programs for those of us.
RADDATZ: But let – let me ask you this. What – what is your specific plan for seniors who really can't afford to make up the difference in the value of what you call a premium support plan and others call a voucher?
RYAN: Hundred percent coverage...
RADDATZ: And what...
(CROSSTALK)
RYAN: That's what we're saying. So we're saying...
RADDATZ: How do you make that up?
RYAN: ...income adjusts (inaudible) these premium support payments by taking down the subsidies for wealthy people.
Look, this is a plan – by the way, that $6,400 number, it was misleading then, it's totally inaccurate now. This is a plan that's bipartisan. It's a plan I put together with a prominent Democrat senator from Oregon.
BIDEN: There's not one Democrat who endorses it.
RYAN: It's a plan...
BIDEN: Not one Democrat who (inaudible).
RYAN: Our partner is a Democrat from Oregon.
BIDEN: And he said he does no longer support (inaudible).
RYAN: We – we – we put it – we put it together with the former Clinton budget director.
BIDEN: Who disavows it.
RYAN: This idea – this idea came from the Clinton commission to save Medicare chaired by Senator John Breaux.
Here's the point, Martha.
BIDEN: Which was rejected.
Comment by Scoopster on 10/12/2012 15:33:05
I think it was somewhere around the half hour mark..
Scoopster on 10/12/2012 15:33:05
Quote by Raine:Quote by Scoopster:
Okay done with the debate.. jeez what a clobberin'!
Oh yeh I didn't mention it when I heard it, but hooooly shit @ Ryan using a car crash anecdote to score points against Biden! If he just overlooked the fact that Biden's wife & daughter were KILLED in a car crash, it's a huge blunder. If he did it intentionally tho, the guy's a bigger scumbag than we ever thought.
Scoop do you remember about where in the debate that was (I am trying to read the transcript.)
I think it was somewhere around the half hour mark..
Comment by Raine on 10/12/2012 15:33:54
Raine on 10/12/2012 15:33:54
RADDATZ: You were one of the few lawmakers to stand with President Bush when he was seeking to partially privatize Social Security.
RYAN: For younger people. What we said then, and what I've always agreed is let younger Americans have a voluntary choice of making their money work faster for them within the Social Security system.
BIDEN: You saw how well that worked.
RYAN: That's not what Mitt Romney's proposing. What we’re saying is no changes for anybody 55 and above.
Comment by 
Will in Chicago on 10/12/2012 15:45:46
Will in Chicago on 10/12/2012 15:45:46
BobR, thanks for a great blog.
I think that Biden showed that the Obama-Biden campaign is ready to fight hard. Incumbent presidents usually do poorly on the first debate.
I think that Biden should be used more often as an attack dog. The Republicans and their allies in the media are whining, but had no problem with Romney ignoring the rules of the debate and making up rules as he went along.
Ryan seemed unready to step up to the plate to be President. Biden seemed to be confident and supremely competent.
I think that Biden showed that the Obama-Biden campaign is ready to fight hard. Incumbent presidents usually do poorly on the first debate.
I think that Biden should be used more often as an attack dog. The Republicans and their allies in the media are whining, but had no problem with Romney ignoring the rules of the debate and making up rules as he went along.
Ryan seemed unready to step up to the plate to be President. Biden seemed to be confident and supremely competent.
Comment by Raine on 10/12/2012 15:49:04
was it this?
Raine on 10/12/2012 15:49:04
Quote by Scoopster:
I think it was somewhere around the half hour mark..
RYAN: He talks about Detroit. Mitt Romney’s a car guy. They keep misquoting him, but let me tell you about the Mitt Romney I know. This is a guy who I was talking to a family in Northborough, Massachusetts the other day, Sheryl and Mark Nixon. Their kids were hit in a car crash, four of them. Two of them, Rob and Reed, were paralyzed. The Romneys didn’t know them. They went to the same church; they never met before.
Mitt asked if he could come over on Christmas. He brought his boys, his wife, and gifts. Later on, he said, “I know you’re struggling, Mark. Don’t worry about their college. I’ll pay for it.â€
When Mark told me this story, because, you know what, Mitt Romney doesn’t tell these stories. The Nixons told this story. When he told me this story, he said it wasn’t the help, the cash help. It’s that he gave his time, and he has consistently.
Comment by Mondobubba on 10/12/2012 15:52:59
Mondobubba on 10/12/2012 15:52:59
Just did a Jim Ward Vader!
Comment by TriSec on 10/12/2012 15:53:49
TriSec on 10/12/2012 15:53:49
Chortle, snort
At the end of the night Paul Ryan held his own on style points. He was able to deliver the rehearsed lines technically. But in the end he looked like he was wearing an ill-fitting suit. Something that looked ok at first glance, but was quickly revealed to be little more than an optical illusion.
Comment by Scoopster on 10/12/2012 15:56:19
Yeah that's it.. The way Ryan worked it in seems more like he just plain didn't know about Biden's family.. Either way Joe didn't let it rattle him, which I thought was really classy.
Scoopster on 10/12/2012 15:56:19
Quote by Raine:was it this?Quote by Scoopster:
I think it was somewhere around the half hour mark..RYAN: He talks about Detroit. Mitt Romney’s a car guy. They keep misquoting him, but let me tell you about the Mitt Romney I know. This is a guy who I was talking to a family in Northborough, Massachusetts the other day, Sheryl and Mark Nixon. Their kids were hit in a car crash, four of them. Two of them, Rob and Reed, were paralyzed. The Romneys didn’t know them. They went to the same church; they never met before.
Mitt asked if he could come over on Christmas. He brought his boys, his wife, and gifts. Later on, he said, “I know you’re struggling, Mark. Don’t worry about their college. I’ll pay for it.â€
When Mark told me this story, because, you know what, Mitt Romney doesn’t tell these stories. The Nixons told this story. When he told me this story, he said it wasn’t the help, the cash help. It’s that he gave his time, and he has consistently.
Yeah that's it.. The way Ryan worked it in seems more like he just plain didn't know about Biden's family.. Either way Joe didn't let it rattle him, which I thought was really classy.
Comment by wickedpam on 10/12/2012 16:02:07
what I just picked up from that was that this family is part of the Mormon church and that they take care of their own only. If they hadn't gone to they same church would he make the same statement?
wickedpam on 10/12/2012 16:02:07
Quote by Scoopster:Quote by Raine:was it this?Quote by Scoopster:
I think it was somewhere around the half hour mark..RYAN: He talks about Detroit. Mitt Romney’s a car guy. They keep misquoting him, but let me tell you about the Mitt Romney I know. This is a guy who I was talking to a family in Northborough, Massachusetts the other day, Sheryl and Mark Nixon. Their kids were hit in a car crash, four of them. Two of them, Rob and Reed, were paralyzed. The Romneys didn’t know them. They went to the same church; they never met before.
Mitt asked if he could come over on Christmas. He brought his boys, his wife, and gifts. Later on, he said, “I know you’re struggling, Mark. Don’t worry about their college. I’ll pay for it.â€
When Mark told me this story, because, you know what, Mitt Romney doesn’t tell these stories. The Nixons told this story. When he told me this story, he said it wasn’t the help, the cash help. It’s that he gave his time, and he has consistently.
Yeah that's it.. The way Ryan worked it in seems more like he just plain didn't know about Biden's family.. Either way Joe didn't let it rattle him, which I thought was really classy.
what I just picked up from that was that this family is part of the Mormon church and that they take care of their own only. If they hadn't gone to they same church would he make the same statement?
Comment by Raine on 10/12/2012 16:05:54
It was tacky, and once again... We get a human interest story from Romney that involves misery. At least this time it wasn't death.
Did you guys read the story I posted yesterday about Romney and Women he interacted with in the church?
Raine on 10/12/2012 16:05:54
Quote by wickedpam:Quote by Scoopster:
Yeah that's it.. The way Ryan worked it in seems more like he just plain didn't know about Biden's family.. Either way Joe didn't let it rattle him, which I thought was really classy.
what I just picked up from that was that this family is part of the Mormon church and that they take care of their own only. If they hadn't gone to they same church would he make the same statement?
Did you guys read the story I posted yesterday about Romney and Women he interacted with in the church?
Comment by trojanrabbit on 10/12/2012 16:09:45
trojanrabbit on 10/12/2012 16:09:45
Anybody tuning in to Oxy-Boy today?
Comment by wickedpam on 10/12/2012 16:10:18
I think I missed it - had a lot going on in the office
wickedpam on 10/12/2012 16:10:18
Quote by Raine:It was tacky, and once again... We get a human interest story from Romney that involves misery. At least this time it wasn't death.Quote by wickedpam:Quote by Scoopster:
Yeah that's it.. The way Ryan worked it in seems more like he just plain didn't know about Biden's family.. Either way Joe didn't let it rattle him, which I thought was really classy.
what I just picked up from that was that this family is part of the Mormon church and that they take care of their own only. If they hadn't gone to they same church would he make the same statement?
Did you guys read the story I posted yesterday about Romney and Women he interacted with in the church?
I think I missed it - had a lot going on in the office
Comment by Raine on 10/12/2012 16:12:12
Raine on 10/12/2012 16:12:12
One thing I noticed last night, Paul Ryan has a *TELL*
When he says 'Look, ____________" you can guarantee he's bluffing.
He did it8 14 times last night. I just checked.
(EDITED, I double checked)
When he says 'Look, ____________" you can guarantee he's bluffing.
He did it
I just checked. (EDITED, I double checked)
Comment by Raine on 10/12/2012 16:15:55
This is the Excerpt from Huffpo, but if you have the time, I really suggest really the full article. I was dumfounded.
I know it was pretty late in the afternoon when I posted it, but it's worth the read.
Raine on 10/12/2012 16:15:55
Quote by wickedpam:
I think I missed it - had a lot going on in the office
I know it was pretty late in the afternoon when I posted it, but it's worth the read.
Comment by Raine on 10/12/2012 16:16:28
Oh. Dear. I don't think so.
Raine on 10/12/2012 16:16:28
Quote by trojanrabbit:
Anybody tuning in to Oxy-Boy today?
Comment by trojanrabbit on 10/12/2012 16:22:24
Getting this second-hand, but so far it's "Biden's a big meanie poopie head" and "The moderator is a liberal plant"
Sounds about right.
trojanrabbit on 10/12/2012 16:22:24
Quote by Raine:Oh. Dear. I don't think so.Quote by trojanrabbit:
Anybody tuning in to Oxy-Boy today?
Getting this second-hand, but so far it's "Biden's a big meanie poopie head" and "The moderator is a liberal plant"
Sounds about right.
Comment by 
livingonli on 10/12/2012 16:25:14
livingonli on 10/12/2012 16:25:14
Good day, folks. I'm listening to Ed since I couldn't listen to Oxy-boy if you paid me a small fortune since I would keep puking. Too bad I was at work because I would have loved to have watched this debate especially when Ryan was whipped like a bitch. It's interesting when things don't work out for the GOP, they always blame it on Liberal bias and ignore things like factcheck and such. I guess they thought like in the Bush years or even with Gingrich that they could just keep lying and get away with it.
Comment by Raine on 10/12/2012 16:25:21
Raine on 10/12/2012 16:25:21
Quote by trojanrabbit:Quote by Raine:Oh. Dear. I don't think so.Quote by trojanrabbit:
Anybody tuning in to Oxy-Boy today?
Getting this second-hand, but so far it's "Biden's a big meanie poopie head" and "The moderator is a liberal plant"
Sounds about right.
Comment by Raine on 10/12/2012 16:34:23
Raine on 10/12/2012 16:34:23
Comment by trojanrabbit on 10/12/2012 16:35:41
trojanrabbit on 10/12/2012 16:35:41
Sarah Failin compares Biden's treatment of Ryan to a musk ox running across the tundra with someone underfoot.
Strange that I can't find any similar comments from the Half-Governor about Romney.
Strange that I can't find any similar comments from the Half-Governor about Romney.
Comment by livingonli on 10/12/2012 16:39:36
livingonli on 10/12/2012 16:39:36
If it wasn't for all the chaos with my pending move, and the clock is ticking I would have so loved to have gone to NYCC this weekend. I have to put in for it next year at least by then my life should be a lot calmer.
Comment by wickedpam on 10/12/2012 16:40:03
gawd, just more evidence of what a douche he is
wickedpam on 10/12/2012 16:40:03
Quote by Raine:This is the Excerpt from Huffpo, but if you have the time, I really suggest really the full article. I was dumfounded.Quote by wickedpam:
I think I missed it - had a lot going on in the office
I know it was pretty late in the afternoon when I posted it, but it's worth the read.
gawd, just more evidence of what a douche he is
Comment by TriSec on 10/12/2012 16:41:23
Ryan: I'm a Catholic, and what the church believes must be the law of the land.
Biden: I'm a Catholic, and you can still talk to your doctor and decide.
Nothing could be more clearer than that.
TriSec on 10/12/2012 16:41:23
Quote by Raine:
Good write about about the BEAN comment.
andfor those that missed it last night:
Ryan: I'm a Catholic, and what the church believes must be the law of the land.
Biden: I'm a Catholic, and you can still talk to your doctor and decide.
Nothing could be more clearer than that.
Comment by TriSec on 10/12/2012 16:49:53
TriSec on 10/12/2012 16:49:53
Comment by trojanrabbit on 10/12/2012 16:53:32
The Church also believes that kiddy-diddlers need to be shielded.
trojanrabbit on 10/12/2012 16:53:32
Quote by TriSec:Quote by Raine:
Good write about about the BEAN comment.
andfor those that missed it last night:
Ryan: I'm a Catholic, and what the church believes must be the law of the land.
Biden: I'm a Catholic, and you can still talk to your doctor and decide.
Nothing could be more clearer than that.
The Church also believes that kiddy-diddlers need to be shielded.
Comment by livingonli on 10/12/2012 16:54:16
livingonli on 10/12/2012 16:54:16
Ed's really tearing into Mittens and the whole 1% philosophy that he represents right now.
Comment by Raine on 10/12/2012 17:00:41
Raine on 10/12/2012 17:00:41
They really have no shame.
Florida GOP Group Uses Image Of Dead Ambassador’s Body In Obama Attack Ad
Florida GOP Group Uses Image Of Dead Ambassador’s Body In Obama Attack Ad
Comment by TriSec on 10/12/2012 17:02:20
TriSec on 10/12/2012 17:02:20
YA know, the GOP just makes me want to vomit and poop a river.
Or maybe it's the chemo; I'm not really sure this week.
Or maybe it's the chemo; I'm not really sure this week.
Comment by Raine on 10/12/2012 17:05:16
Raine on 10/12/2012 17:05:16
I heard this wquestion as well last night and found it a terrible one. Think PRogress has a good assessment: How A Terrible Debate Question Helped Paul Ryan Mislead About Social Security I believe Radditz did a FAR better job than Jim Lerher, but I did have issues with some of the ways she asked questions, this is a good example.
RADDATZ: Let’s talk about Medicare and entitlements. Both Medicare and Social Security are going broke and taking a larger share of the budget in the process. Will benefits for Americans under these programs have to change for the programs to survive? Mr. Ryan.
RYAN: Absolutely. Medicare and Social Security are going bankrupt. These are indisputable facts.
Comment by Mondobubba on 10/12/2012 17:13:27
Stay KKKlassy Florida GOP.
Mondobubba on 10/12/2012 17:13:27
Quote by Raine:
They really have no shame.
Florida GOP Group Uses Image Of Dead Ambassador’s Body In Obama Attack Ad
Stay KKKlassy Florida GOP.
Comment by Mondobubba on 10/12/2012 17:32:55
My method is eaiser. When Paul Ryan opens his pie hole, untruth spews forth. No need for a tell, lips a flapin' Ryan's lying.
Mondobubba on 10/12/2012 17:32:55
Quote by Raine:
One thing I noticed last night, Paul Ryan has a *TELL*
When he says 'Look, ____________" you can guarantee he's bluffing.
He did it814 times last night.
(EDITED, I double checked)
My method is eaiser. When Paul Ryan opens his pie hole, untruth spews forth. No need for a tell, lips a flapin' Ryan's lying.
Comment by Will in Chicago on 10/12/2012 17:44:16
Raddatz should have worded the question far better and not fall into a presumed common wisdom. T
Will in Chicago on 10/12/2012 17:44:16
Quote by Raine:
I heard this wquestion as well last night and found it a terrible one. Think PRogress has a good assessment: How A Terrible Debate Question Helped Paul Ryan Mislead About Social SecurityI believe Radditz did a FAR better job than Jim Lerher, but I did have issues with some of the ways she asked questions, this is a good example.RADDATZ: Let’s talk about Medicare and entitlements. Both Medicare and Social Security are going broke and taking a larger share of the budget in the process. Will benefits for Americans under these programs have to change for the programs to survive? Mr. Ryan.
RYAN: Absolutely. Medicare and Social Security are going bankrupt. These are indisputable facts.
Raddatz should have worded the question far better and not fall into a presumed common wisdom. T
Comment by Mondobubba on 10/12/2012 17:44:59
Mondobubba on 10/12/2012 17:44:59
Comment by Mondobubba on 10/12/2012 19:07:52
Mondobubba on 10/12/2012 19:07:52
Where'd everybody go? 
Comment by trojanrabbit on 10/12/2012 19:15:10
Dunno
trojanrabbit on 10/12/2012 19:15:10
Quote by Mondobubba:
Where'd everybody go?
Dunno
Comment by Mondobubba on 10/12/2012 19:17:25
Hurrumph!
Mondobubba on 10/12/2012 19:17:25
Quote by trojanrabbit:Quote by Mondobubba:
Where'd everybody go?
Dunno
Hurrumph!
Comment by Will in Chicago on 10/12/2012 19:17:36
I am on hold with Nicole Sandler on the Thom Hartmann show -- listening to WCPT. (Nicole was very nice in working with Jeff Farias in Phoenix when she was just starting up Radio or Not.)
Will in Chicago on 10/12/2012 19:17:36
Quote by trojanrabbit:Quote by Mondobubba:
Where'd everybody go?
Dunno
I am on hold with Nicole Sandler on the Thom Hartmann show -- listening to WCPT. (Nicole was very nice in working with Jeff Farias in Phoenix when she was just starting up Radio or Not.)
Comment by Will in Chicago on 10/12/2012 19:24:30
Will in Chicago on 10/12/2012 19:24:30
Good news. My brother called from the hospital. My sister-in-law Holly had the angiogram, but it indicated no problem that requires surgery. (My brother said that she was okay, so I guess there was either no problem or one that is treatable without surgery.)
Thanks for the well-wishes.
Thanks for the well-wishes.
Comment by Raine on 10/12/2012 19:26:40
We went to lunch and then ran errands.
Raine on 10/12/2012 19:26:40
Quote by Mondobubba:
Where'd everybody go?
We went to lunch and then ran errands.
Comment by Raine on 10/12/2012 19:32:04
This is great news!
Raine on 10/12/2012 19:32:04
Quote by Will in Chicago:
Good news. My brother called from the hospital. My sister-in-law Holly had the angiogram, but it indicated no problem that requires surgery. (My brother said that she was okay, so I guess there was either no problem or one that is treatable without surgery.)
Thanks for the well-wishes.
Comment by Mondobubba on 10/12/2012 19:38:03
Woohoo!
Mondobubba on 10/12/2012 19:38:03
Quote by Will in Chicago:
Good news. My brother called from the hospital. My sister-in-law Holly had the angiogram, but it indicated no problem that requires surgery. (My brother said that she was okay, so I guess there was either no problem or one that is treatable without surgery.)
Thanks for the well-wishes.
Woohoo!
Comment by Raine on 10/12/2012 19:39:56
Raine on 10/12/2012 19:39:56
You know, the more I think about last night, the more I realize that not only did Joe Biden handily win that debate for the President, he made a very very strong case for congress and a democratic majority.
Especially after reading this from Dana Millbank:
Especially after reading this from Dana Millbank:
The emphasis on congressional Republicans was key to Biden’s strong performance in Kentucky, because it provided a more favorable way for Democrats to frame the campaign: not as a choice between President Obama and some abstract alternative but a choice between Obama and the dimly regarded Republican-led House, which would be in a dominant position under a President Romney. Romney’s views may be all over the lot, but the positions of Republicans on Capitol Hill are clear and stark.
Comment by Raine on 10/12/2012 19:57:30
Raine on 10/12/2012 19:57:30
Comment by Scoopster on 10/12/2012 20:15:05
Actually several of my friends have told me they also nickname or referred to their kids in the womb as 'bean' or something similar. I guess it's fairly common!
Scoopster on 10/12/2012 20:15:05
Quote by Raine:Smells like teambullshit...Quote by Scoopster:
OH WOW I DIDN'T CATCH THIS!
Actually several of my friends have told me they also nickname or referred to their kids in the womb as 'bean' or something similar. I guess it's fairly common!
Comment by Raine on 10/12/2012 20:16:48
Raine on 10/12/2012 20:16:48
Randi just brought this up, and I said it last night-- at one point, Biden had to fact check Raddatz: (bold face is what I am getting at) It's not her job to editorialize things.
RADDATZ: Quickly, Vice President Biden on this. I want to move on.
BIDEN: Look, we don't cut it. And I might add, this so-called — I know we don’t want to use the fancy word "sequester," this automatic cut — that was part of a debt deal that they asked for.
And let me tell you what my friend said at a press conference announcing his support of the deal. He said, and I'm paraphrase, We’ve been looking for this moment for a long time.
RYAN: Can I tell you what that meant?
(CROSSTALK)
RYAN: We've been looking for bipartisanship for a long time.
BIDEN: And so the bipartisanship is what he voted for, the automatic cuts in defense if they didn't act.
And beyond that, they asked for another — look, the military says we need a smaller, leaner Army, we need more special forces, we need — we don't need more M1 tanks, what we need is more UAVs.
RADDATZ: Some of the military.
(CROSSTALK)
BIDEN: Not some of the military. That was the decision of the Joint Chiefs of Staff, recommended to us and agreed to by the president. That is a fact.
RADDATZ: Who answers to a civilian leader.
BIDEN: They made the recommendation first.
RADDATZ: OK. Let's move on to Afghanistan.
Comment by Raine on 10/12/2012 20:17:29
I can see it, but still...
Raine on 10/12/2012 20:17:29
Quote by Scoopster:Quote by Raine:Smells like teambullshit...Quote by Scoopster:
OH WOW I DIDN'T CATCH THIS!
Actually several of my friends have told me they also nickname or referred to their kids in the womb as 'bean' or something similar. I guess it's fairly common!
Comment by Scoopster on 10/12/2012 20:24:33
Scoopster on 10/12/2012 20:24:33
And it seems the auto-refresh button doesn't want to work anymore!
Comment by trojanrabbit on 10/12/2012 20:25:32
Hasn't worked for a while. Though I'm too lazy to want to try a reboot.
trojanrabbit on 10/12/2012 20:25:32
Quote by Scoopster:
And it seems the auto-refresh button doesn't want to work anymore!
Hasn't worked for a while. Though I'm too lazy to want to try a reboot.
Comment by Raine on 10/12/2012 20:33:28
Raine on 10/12/2012 20:33:28
I'd like to hear more about this, because if this is true, this needs to go viral.
If Mitt Romney is elected president, the American flag itself may actually be restricted from flying in the United States. That word comes from employees losing their jobs in Freeport, Illinois.
The Presidential Candidate holds major stock in a company called Sensata. The company recently made factory officials take down the American flag when they were forced to train their Chinese replacement workers, according to Tom Gaulrapp, with the United Steelworkers Union.
Comment by Raine on 10/12/2012 20:37:21
Romney is making a LOT of money off the backs of these people.
Raine on 10/12/2012 20:37:21
Quote by Raine:
I'd like to hear more about this, because if this is true, this needs to go viral.If Mitt Romney is elected president, the American flag itself may actually be restricted from flying in the United States. That word comes from employees losing their jobs in Freeport, Illinois.
The Presidential Candidate holds major stock in a company called Sensata. The company recently made factory officials take down the American flag when they were forced to train their Chinese replacement workers, according to Tom Gaulrapp, with the United Steelworkers Union.
Comment by Raine on 10/12/2012 20:54:52
Raine on 10/12/2012 20:54:52
@CNBC: BREAKING: White House: Full Year 2012 deficit FELL to $1.089 trillion, $207 billion LESS than 2011. #ObamaBiden2012
Comment by Will in Chicago on 10/12/2012 20:57:45
Will in Chicago on 10/12/2012 20:57:45
Well, I was on hold for Nicole, but a friend called and I had to take the call. There is always other times.
Comment by Will in Chicago on 10/12/2012 21:11:10
There goes another Romney talking point.
Will in Chicago on 10/12/2012 21:11:10
Quote by Raine:@CNBC: BREAKING: White House: Full Year 2012 deficit FELL to $1.089 trillion, $207 billion LESS than 2011. #ObamaBiden2012
There goes another Romney talking point.
Comment by Will in Chicago on 10/12/2012 21:15:00
Raine, this is an important story if it is confirmed. I cannot see the image for some reason.
Will in Chicago on 10/12/2012 21:15:00
Quote by Raine:Romney is making a LOT of money off the backs of these people.Quote by Raine:
I'd like to hear more about this, because if this is true, this needs to go viral.If Mitt Romney is elected president, the American flag itself may actually be restricted from flying in the United States. That word comes from employees losing their jobs in Freeport, Illinois.
The Presidential Candidate holds major stock in a company called Sensata. The company recently made factory officials take down the American flag when they were forced to train their Chinese replacement workers, according to Tom Gaulrapp, with the United Steelworkers Union.
Raine, this is an important story if it is confirmed. I cannot see the image for some reason.
Comment by livingonli on 10/12/2012 21:30:11
livingonli on 10/12/2012 21:30:11
That bit needs to be in an ad because I'm sure people will love to hear that Mitt will do more for the Chinese than for American workers who will have to settle for crappy Wal-Mart jobs. Although with the current strikes against Wal-Mart going on, there may be a tipping point there.
Comment by Raine on 10/12/2012 22:00:31
It is from the United Steelworkers Union. I agree -- it would be nice to see this in an ad.
Raine on 10/12/2012 22:00:31
Quote by livingonli:
That bit needs to be in an ad because I'm sure people will love to hear that Mitt will do more for the Chinese than for American workers who will have to settle for crappy Wal-Mart jobs. Although with the current strikes against Wal-Mart going on, there may be a tipping point there.
It is from the United Steelworkers Union. I agree -- it would be nice to see this in an ad.
Comment by Raine on 10/12/2012 22:01:40
I posted the video on my facebook page, and the story does check out. I went to the NYT link and it right there.
Raine on 10/12/2012 22:01:40
Quote by Will in Chicago:
Raine, this is an important story if it is confirmed. I cannot see the image for some reason.
Comment by Will in Chicago on 10/12/2012 22:58:08
I shared the video on facebook and also posted a link to the following story from the New York Times: As Romney Repeats Trade Message, Bain Maintains China Ties,
American workers fought and sometimes died to improve our working conditions. We need an alternative to the race to the bottom. As things stand, it seems to lead to suffering in America and elsewhere and perhaps make the Earth a less sustainable place due to pollution.
Will in Chicago on 10/12/2012 22:58:08
Quote by Raine:I posted the video on my facebook page, and the story does check out. I went to the NYT link and it right there.Quote by Will in Chicago:
Raine, this is an important story if it is confirmed. I cannot see the image for some reason.
I shared the video on facebook and also posted a link to the following story from the New York Times: As Romney Repeats Trade Message, Bain Maintains China Ties,
American workers fought and sometimes died to improve our working conditions. We need an alternative to the race to the bottom. As things stand, it seems to lead to suffering in America and elsewhere and perhaps make the Earth a less sustainable place due to pollution.
Comment by Raine on 10/12/2012 23:07:56
IT was mentioned tonite on Rev Als' show, Rev Al was shocked and said they would cover this story more next week -- BUT --
It was mentioned!
Raine on 10/12/2012 23:07:56
Quote by Will in Chicago:Quote by Raine:I posted the video on my facebook page, and the story does check out. I went to the NYT link and it right there.Quote by Will in Chicago:
Raine, this is an important story if it is confirmed. I cannot see the image for some reason.
I shared the video on facebook and also posted a link to the following story from the New York Times: As Romney Repeats Trade Message, Bain Maintains China Ties,
American workers fought and sometimes died to improve our working conditions. We need an alternative to the race to the bottom. As things stand, it seems to lead to suffering in America and elsewhere and perhaps make the Earth a less sustainable place due to pollution.
It was mentioned!
Comment by Raine on 10/12/2012 23:08:51
You have to read Charlie Pierce' entire piece!
Raine on 10/12/2012 23:08:51
And when Raddatz asked him, deftly, what would be worse, another war in the Middle East or Iran with a nuclear bomb, he leaped in precipitously with the latter, while about 75 percent of the country, including the two other people on stage with him, looked at Ryan as though he'd lost his mind. He did, however, demonstrate a certain talent for pronouncing long foreign words that his briefers had taught him on Tuesday. Also, he explained winter.
You have to read Charlie Pierce' entire piece!
Comment by Will in Chicago on 10/12/2012 23:22:01
I think that others will pick up on this. I think that a good ad should mention the 99 cents an hour wages in China. Sorry, but I do not want to be a wage slave like that.
Will in Chicago on 10/12/2012 23:22:01
Quote by Raine:IT was mentioned tonite on Rev Als' show, Rev Al was shocked and said they would cover this story more next week -- BUT --Quote by Will in Chicago:Quote by Raine:I posted the video on my facebook page, and the story does check out. I went to the NYT link and it right there.Quote by Will in Chicago:
Raine, this is an important story if it is confirmed. I cannot see the image for some reason.
I shared the video on facebook and also posted a link to the following story from the New York Times: As Romney Repeats Trade Message, Bain Maintains China Ties,
American workers fought and sometimes died to improve our working conditions. We need an alternative to the race to the bottom. As things stand, it seems to lead to suffering in America and elsewhere and perhaps make the Earth a less sustainable place due to pollution.
It was mentioned!
I think that others will pick up on this. I think that a good ad should mention the 99 cents an hour wages in China. Sorry, but I do not want to be a wage slave like that.
Comment by Will in Chicago on 10/12/2012 23:24:24
That is good, but I hope that this comes to pass:
Comedy gold!!
Will in Chicago on 10/12/2012 23:24:24
Quote by Raine:And when Raddatz asked him, deftly, what would be worse, another war in the Middle East or Iran with a nuclear bomb, he leaped in precipitously with the latter, while about 75 percent of the country, including the two other people on stage with him, looked at Ryan as though he'd lost his mind. He did, however, demonstrate a certain talent for pronouncing long foreign words that his briefers had taught him on Tuesday. Also, he explained winter.
You have to read Charlie Pierce' entire piece!
That is good, but I hope that this comes to pass:
There is a deeply held Beltway myth of Paul Ryan, Man of Big Ideas, and it dies hard. But, if there is a just god in the universe, on Thursday night, it died a bloody death, was hurled into a pit, doused with quicklime, buried without ceremony, and the ground above it salted and strewn with garlic so that it never rises again.
Comedy gold!!
Comment by BobR on 10/13/2012 00:59:32
Do you mean here on the blog?
BobR on 10/13/2012 00:59:32
Quote by trojanrabbit:Quote by Scoopster:
And it seems the auto-refresh button doesn't want to work anymore!
Hasn't worked for a while. Though I'm too lazy to want to try a reboot.
Do you mean here on the blog?
Comment by livingonli on 10/13/2012 01:21:53
Auto-refresh doesn't seem to be working on Firefox again since I am on Firefox at work and it is not responding to new posts.
livingonli on 10/13/2012 01:21:53
Quote by BobR:Quote by trojanrabbit:Quote by Scoopster:
And it seems the auto-refresh button doesn't want to work anymore!
Hasn't worked for a while. Though I'm too lazy to want to try a reboot.
Do you mean here on the blog?
Auto-refresh doesn't seem to be working on Firefox again since I am on Firefox at work and it is not responding to new posts.
Comment by BobR on 10/13/2012 04:59:28
That's a JQuery/AJAX thing - same as what Facebook uses
BobR on 10/13/2012 04:59:28
Quote by livingonli:Quote by BobR:Quote by trojanrabbit:Quote by Scoopster:
And it seems the auto-refresh button doesn't want to work anymore!
Hasn't worked for a while. Though I'm too lazy to want to try a reboot.
Do you mean here on the blog?
Auto-refresh doesn't seem to be working on Firefox again since I am on Firefox at work and it is not responding to new posts.
That's a JQuery/AJAX thing - same as what Facebook uses