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Libertarian Saturday
Author: TriSec    Date: 06/28/2008 12:41:49

Good Morning!

Well, we've been having a lively debate this week on the recent decisions of the Supreme Court. It should come as no surprise that the LP has issued several statements about them, too. But we'll actually start with the recent passage of the FISA bill through the senate. It's unfortunate that Sen. Obama chose to support it; let's hope he can recover from this obvious blunder. (I know of at least a handful of 'one-issue voters' that have already abandoned the Senator from Illinois over this.) Of course, I find it curious that while the LP is attacking Senator Obama, the other candidate, who has supported this all along, gets a free pass...


The Libertarian Party condemned Democratic presidential nominee Barack Obama for recently stating he does not oppose the Bush administration's program of illegally spying on U.S. citizens. "Obama has sold out liberty in his refusal to stand up to Republicans on FISA," says Libertarian Party spokesperson Andrew Davis.

"We have come to expect Republicans to hold a contempt for basic protections of civil liberties," says Davis. "To see this same type of reckless disregard for the Constitution from Democrats--especially their presidential nominee--is extremely unfortunate. Democrats were given a chance to stand up to Republicans after the 2006 election, but they have failed to do so time and time again ever since. Obama's refusal to state a clear opposition to the President's illegal program of domestic surveillance is just one more example of how both Republicans and Democrats have failed the American people."

In an interview last week with ABC News' Senior National Correspondent Jack Tapper, Obama stated, "I haven't opposed, for example, the national security surveillance program, the NSA program," adding that he believed the program could be done without violating the Constitution.

"Perhaps it is in Obama's nature as a big-government liberal to trust the government with unchecked power," Davis adds, "but supporting a proposal to give the government blanket permission to spy on American citizens should give voters an idea of how much Obama respects the Constitution and privacy rights."

The Libertarian Party has called repeatedly to reject any amendment to the Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Act that empowers the government to spy on U.S. citizens, which includes the most recent "compromise" by Republicans and Democrats. Additionally, Libertarian Party candidate for president Bob Barr recently issued a video that blasted supporters of the recent FISA amendments.




Along those lines, the party thinks neither candidate has done enough about gun rights, which IMHO does nothing to deter the public perception that all the Libertarians care about is guns and drugs...


Presidential candidates Barack Obama and John McCain both share a spotty history on gun rights and should not be granted a free pass with their recent rhetoric, says the Libertarian Party. "McCain and Obama are no friends to the Second Amendment, despite what they now say on the campaign trail," says Libertarian Party National Chairman William Redpath.

"Both Obama and McCain have a history of anti-gun rhetoric and legislation," says Redpath. "No matter how pro-gun their campaign rhetoric may be, they can't erase their past statements and votes as Republican and Democratic gun-grabbers. While a conscientious change of heart on the issue is nothing to be ashamed of, Obama and McCain's flip-flop on the issue of guns appears to be an obligatory, almost pathetic, appeal to a demographic to which they have never been faithful."

In the past, McCain has taken heat for his involvement with the group "Americans for Gun Safety," which the National Rifle Association (NRA) has called "neither nonpartisan nor a friend of gun owners." McCain has a "C+" rating on gun issues from the NRA, who once called him "one of the premier flag carriers for the enemies of the Second Amendment."

Obama, who in the past has supported legislation regulating the sale of handguns and other forms of gun control, has frequently stated on the campaign trail that the Second Amendment is an individual right--though one that can be regulated.

"Obama's position on the Second Amendment is even more damaging than some of the positions McCain has taken on guns in the past," says Libertarian Party Spokesperson Andrew Davis. "To call something a right, but at the same time saying it is a right that can be subject to 'reasonable' limitations, completely undermines the very notion of Constitutionally-protected rights. The Libertarian Party recognizes that there is a certain extent as to how far rights can go, but we shudder to think at what Obama might consider a 'reasonable' limitation."

The Libertarian Party hailed the recent Heller decision in a press release issued yesterday. The Party opposes the prosecution of individuals for exercising their rights of self-defense. It also opposes all laws at any level of government requiring registration of, or restricting, the ownership, manufacturing, or transfer or sale of firearms or ammunition.



We'll switch gears just a little bit, and take a look now at some recent comments by Ralph Nader concerning the Senator from Illinois, and his 'appealing to white guilt'. In the early days of the internets, I once had an argument with someone about this....the civil war was finished (at least in northern history books) over 140 years ago, and my family didn't even come to the US until the early 20th century....so could I please be exempted from any collective guilt over slavery?

Charley Reese seems to think so....and he's basically blamed Nader for George Bush and told him to "shut the hell up."

It's funny that Ralph Nader, the perennial presidential-election spoiler, is claiming that Barack Obama is appealing to white guilt. I've seen no evidence of that. In fact, Obama has been trying his best to run a colorblind campaign.

The truth is, except for his skin color, Obama is your standard Northern liberal. If there's only a dime's worth of difference between Republicans and Democrats, there's only a penny's worth of difference between Obama and Teddy Kennedy on matters of policy. Obama, however, is certainly the smarter of the two.

I've never been a fan of Nader, and I don't see why anyone is paying him the least bit of attention. He says what he thinks will get him ink and airtime. He's a publicity hound. There's something perverse about people who will run for office, knowing they can't win, but are willing to skim a few votes off one of the major candidates. Nader definitely cost Al Gore the election in 2000, so we can justly blame him for eight years of George W. Bush. As far as I'm concerned, that consigns Nader to the dung heap.

In reality, I'm not sure that there is even such a thing as white guilt. Most Northerners seem to feel self-righteous on race matters, having for years enjoyed blaming the South. Most Southerners don't feel any guilt. I don't. I never owned any slaves, and I was glad to see the end of segregation. What's to feel guilty about?

Whatever profits accrued to the South as a result of slavery were wiped out by the War of Northern Aggression and Reconstruction. The South, both blacks and whites, was plunged into poverty, from which it didn't begin to recover until World War II. While scientists were working on the atomic bomb in the 1940s in Chicago, Georgia tenant farmers, many of them, were picking cotton by hand and carrying it to the gin in mule-drawn wagons.

Outhouses, wells and oil lamps were familiar objects in my childhood. I went barefoot all summer, except for Sundays, and the only free lunches came from friends and relatives during visits. Believe it or not, people managed to survive without welfare, Medicaid or Medicare. I chopped kindling with an axe and carried in many a bucket of good old Pennsylvania anthracite coal for the fireplaces and stoves. My treasured possessions were a pocketknife, a secondhand .22 rifle and marbles.

No one I can recall considered himself poor or felt any guilt. If Obama receives any votes because of white guilt, it will be in the North or Midwest. Perhaps that is appropriate, since it was people from those regions who screwed the former slaves out of the promised 40 acres and a mule and cut a deal with the Democrats that made segregation possible.

And if there was segregation by law in the South, there was segregation by practice in the North. I grew up in a sea of black faces and played every day with black kids. There were no black ghettos in most of the South; black people lived a block from my house.

That said, was it tough being black in the segregated South? You bet. In some places, a wrong word or even a look could get you beaten or killed. Job opportunities were as scarce as voter registration. Apartheid was about the same in the South as in South Africa, although white Southerners – some of them, anyway – were naturally more polite than the Afrikaners. Schools were separate and unequal. The N-word and "boy" were constant affronts to men's dignity. Obama and people in his age group are lucky in the year of their birth.

But we Americans are not very good at feeling guilty. If you don't believe me, ask the Cheyenne, the Cherokee or the Sioux.



So, there you have it. I've got a Tenant's Association meeting in a few hours, and we're still cleaning up from yesterday (see the blog last night for some pictures). I'll be in and out...


 

107 comments (Latest Comment: 06/29/2008 11:51:07 by trojanrabbit)
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Comment by trojanrabbit on 06/28/2008 13:43:37
Good morning to everyone. TriSec I hope everything's OK out there. The really bad stuff passed to the north of us.



Working today, catching up on the SMS shows for the week. One nice thing about working on the weekends is that you can play stuff as loud as you want because there's no one to bother you.



This weekend you may run into groups of people in tents with lots of antennas set up. The last weekend in June is Amateur Radio Field Day, which is supposed to show how communications can be provided in cases of emergency, and it has been shown many times that during emergencies you can't depend upon cellphones to get your message across. Points are given for the number of contacts made (US contacts only) with bonus points given if the stations are run from generators or more points for alternate type power (i.e. solar).



One of the really nasty aspects of being a contractor rather than an employee is that you're shut out of many activities. There will be a Field Day setup at work this weekend (and I'll probably go outside and visit during lunch, weather permitting), but as a contractor I cannot join the radio club here. My real participation days are probably behind me anyway, I'm sufficiently out of shape that any exertion in the usual June 90+ New England steam heat isn't a good thing. One thing I can say about the group I work with here however is that I'm pretty much treated as one of them and I'm lucky to have such a group of co-workers.

Comment by m-hadley on 06/28/2008 13:58:24
Mornin' TriSec & Trojan,

Just a small question about FISA - I know it looks like it is an inevitability, but I thought that the mighty Russ Feingold put the final vote off until after the 4th of July recess - please correct me if I am wrong about this. I think Senator Feingold was hoping that there might be an opportunity to strip the legislation of the onerous retroactive immunity for the telecom companies before the final vote - I wish him luck although I'm not holding my breath. I've been disappointed by Obama several times this last week, but I understand the political strategy of tacking center in the election then going ahead and governing from where you really stand once you get in office, but the expediency of Obama's positions doesn't please me much. Vamos a ver...

Cheers,

mfaye

:heart:

Comment by capt on 06/28/2008 14:12:55
Good Morning!





Comment by trojanrabbit on 06/28/2008 14:16:35
Good morning mfaye and capt



At least according to this on DailyKos, the FISA vote is going to held back until July 8th, in the slight hope that Senators will look over this bill during their week off and come to their senses. And I weigh 225 ---- fat chance.



http://www.dailykos.com/story/2008/6/26/193828/906/525/542571

Comment by capt on 06/28/2008 14:18:18
Re FISA



They bought some time to pow-wow about it.



It can be stopped if the dem leadership[sic] has the will.



If the dem's and Obama think they can take the neg hit because they are so popular - I fear Barack is falling for the old school menatlity - but he will have to give and take as there are too many DINO's for now.



UGH - still nothing Barack could do would make him worse than McCain (IMHO)

Comment by capt on 06/28/2008 14:23:06
Lest we forget both sides of the aisle know darn well who and how they will vote - there are no real surprises.



My guess is the Dem's allowed the FISA to come up knowing they would get trashed - then hold it until after they return on the 8th.



Sadly, the poll numbers and $$$$ have been so good the d's figure they can take the hit.



I hope I'm wrong but I think it is really about covering Pelosi, Reid and Hoyer's collective butts





Comment by Raine on 06/28/2008 14:26:57
Good morning everyone. Cloudy today in the ATl. but I suspect it is just a teaz, I doubt we will get rain.

Comment by BobR on 06/28/2008 14:32:47
Quote by capt:

Re FISA



They bought some time to pow-wow about it.



It can be stopped if the dem leadership[sic] has the will.



If the dem's and Obama think they can take the neg hit because they are so popular - I fear Barack is falling for the old school menatlity - but he will have to give and take as there are too many DINO's for now.



UGH - still nothing Barack could do would make him worse than McCain (IMHO)


There's been some back and forth between Glenn Greenwald and Keith Olbermann about Obama supporting the bill. Keith believes that although the bill provides retroactive immunity from civil lawsuits, it does not provide retroactive immunity to criminal prosecution. He thinks the Obama Justice Dept. will persue criminal charges once he gets into office, if they find there is evidence to support it.



Greenwald thinks that's pie-in-the-sky wishful thinking, and says Bush can pardon the telecoms on his way out the door.



I'm not so sure about that. Can Bush pardon a company of a crime for which they haven't yet been charged? I thought pardons were just for convicted offenders.



Comment by trojanrabbit on 06/28/2008 14:40:47
Didn't Poppy Bush pre-emptively pardon everyone connected with Iran-Contra? If so, there's your answer.

Comment by capt on 06/28/2008 14:41:02
Technically a pardon is for a conviction but . . . Why would Bush follow any law, rule or tradition.







About the Presidential Power to Pardon





Comment by capt on 06/28/2008 14:42:56
Think Nixon even before Iran-contra . . .



Grrrrrrr



We should have stopped that somehow.

Comment by capt on 06/28/2008 14:45:14
Q: Can a president issue a blanket pardon to an individual for crimes that may have been committed in the past but have not yet been discovered?



A: Yes. That's just what Gerald Ford did when he granted "a full, free, and absolute pardon" to Richard Nixon for crimes he "has committed or may have committed" while in office.







Ford's pardon ended any possibility of Nixon being prosecuted criminally.

Comment by trojanrabbit on 06/28/2008 14:55:32
Quote by capt:

Think Nixon even before Iran-contra . . .



Grrrrrrr



We should have stopped that somehow.




I didn't want to go that far back, it makes me violently ill. :puke:



Though as I was coming of political age in the time of Watergate that pretty much convinced me to NEVER EVER vote a Republican for President.



Ford pretty much doomed this country even though he may have thought he was doing the right thing because the architects of the current administration learned their craft from Tricky Dicky.

Comment by capt on 06/28/2008 15:09:49
Lee Atwater, dirty tricks, sneak and peek, wiretaps, voter supression, etc.



That era was so good for the country - AAAARRRRRGGGGGGHHHHHH!!!!





Comment by capt on 06/28/2008 15:12:29
LAFF '08 INTERVIEW | "Boogie Man: The Lee Atwater Story" Director Stefan Forbes



Some folks are going nuts about this movie. I love it when something makes their little pointed heads explode.





Comment by capt on 06/28/2008 15:17:46
And this one . . .



Atwater doc makes conservatives groan



The past fades into obscurity while history repeats itself in kind.

Comment by livingonli on 06/28/2008 15:41:55
Hi everyone. Another hot, muggy day but at least I'm off so I can wear shorts all day. There's a good chance of thunderstorms tonight and Sunday so that should put a damper on a good chunk of the weekend. I guess as long as they can get the Subway series in.

Comment by m-hadley on 06/28/2008 15:49:39
Quote by Raine:

Good morning everyone. Cloudy today in the ATl. but I suspect it is just a teaz, I doubt we will get rain.


Mornin' Raine, BobR, Livin, Capt (I think I got everybody who's checked in this morning - I already said Hey to Tri and Trojan ),

It's a gloomy, overcast day here in Tulsey-Town, both of the boyz are crapped out on the futon (or as my sister calls it "the world's largest doggie bed"). How's Kizzy doing? Does she freak out at thunderstorms? I'm just wondering, 'cause both of my doggies go bananas when it thunders. Anyway, I've already started composing my post for tomorrow morning - am planning on going to an Obama rally this evening if the weather cooperates. I'll let you all know how it goes. I saw a student the other day with an Obama t-shirt on - made me smile as TU is a notoriously right-wing school :(

Cheers,

mfaye

:hug:



Comment by Mondobubba on 06/28/2008 16:04:29
Howdy all. A somewhat busy afternoon ahead I am off to an Obama house party thing in a bit. Should be a bit of fun.

Comment by Raine on 06/28/2008 16:23:30
Obamafternoon to everyone!



Have fun at the rallies and house parties!



Kizzy does NOT like the thunder. She is doing great tho, She seems to have taken to sleeping on the floor next to our bed lately. Last night was interesting because Camille didn't freak out and leave the bed. She get's better and better every day. Today we tried to teach her how to fetch by throwing Popcorn in the air. Somethimes she really isn't a smart dog. It is pretty funny watching popcorn fall off her face....

Comment by Raine on 06/28/2008 16:33:00
Bill Clinton says Barack Obama must 'kiss my ass' for his support



Seriously, that is the friggin headline. The man is losing his ever loving mind.

Comment by capt on 06/28/2008 17:04:40
Quote by Raine:

Bill Clinton says Barack Obama must 'kiss my ass' for his support



Seriously, that is the friggin headline. The man is losing his ever loving mind.




OMG - this line says it all:



he risks damaging his own reputation by his intransigence





Comment by trojanrabbit on 06/28/2008 17:18:49
Quote by capt:

Quote by Raine:

Bill Clinton says Barack Obama must 'kiss my ass' for his support



Seriously, that is the friggin headline. The man is losing his ever loving mind.




OMG - this line says it all:



he risks damaging his own reputation by his intransigence









Pump Head ?

Comment by capt on 06/28/2008 17:35:05
Quote by trojanrabbit:

Quote by capt:

Quote by Raine:

Bill Clinton says Barack Obama must 'kiss my ass' for his support



Seriously, that is the friggin headline. The man is losing his ever loving mind.




OMG - this line says it all:



he risks damaging his own reputation by his intransigence









Pump Head ?




I'm think that is at least a contributing factor. Neurocognitive disorders are seldom even noticed by those that suffer from them. Kind of like trying to explain Alzheimer's to the patient. I wonder if Bill even notices how red faced he has been getting over everything?





Comment by Raine on 06/28/2008 17:46:37
Quote by capt:

Quote by trojanrabbit:

Quote by capt:

Quote by Raine:

Bill Clinton says Barack Obama must 'kiss my ass' for his support



Seriously, that is the friggin headline. The man is losing his ever loving mind.




OMG - this line says it all:



he risks damaging his own reputation by his intransigence









Pump Head ?




I'm think that is at least a contributing factor. Neurocognitive disorders are seldom even noticed by those that suffer from them. Kind of like trying to explain Alzheimer's to the patient. I wonder if Bill even notices how red faced he has been getting over everything?



I think this is indeed going on with him. He is not the same guy I watched in the 90's. It is very disappointing, to tell the truth. As I said earlier this week, it is probably good that he is overseas right now. He still has not officially endorsed, adn that is telling, but on the other side of it, I don't think, seeing how he was during the primaries, it would benefit the dems to have him campaign.



I am however, very aware of the fact that the media really wants to keep the divide between Obama and Clinton alive, and had it not been for the fact that Clinton himself has not spoken of endorsemtn -- personally -- I would have attributed this article to the divide they wish to keep going.



Bill is not Bill these past 6-7 months.



Comment by Mondobubba on 06/28/2008 17:53:02
Quote by Raine:

Bill Clinton says Barack Obama must 'kiss my ass' for his support



Seriously, that is the friggin headline. The man is losing his ever loving mind.






Well this is a British tabloid. That very well might be owned by News Corp. I'm just sayin' :shrug:

Comment by Mondobubba on 06/28/2008 18:03:43
Okay, News Corp. Doesn't own the UK Telegraph, they own the the Aussie Telegraph.

Comment by capt on 06/28/2008 19:01:06
It is sad, he is not the old Bill.





Comment by trojanrabbit on 06/28/2008 19:23:12
On the lighter side - every Saturday on Fark. com is Caturday

Comment by capt on 06/28/2008 19:33:43
Quote by trojanrabbit:

On the lighter side - every Saturday on Fark. com is Caturday




I knew it! They are taking over the world - one day at a time. First it's Caturday what next?



The pictures at Fark are good. I have to have my better half put up a few pictures of our kitties soon (she is out right now).



If anybody wants a good laugh, just watch me hobble to the garage to have a smoke. My legs and back are so sore today I walk like some zombie from a "B" movie - standing up and sitting down is all in extra slo-mo.



Talk about feeling old and out of shape . . .











Comment by Random on 06/28/2008 19:36:06
*clears throat*



Comment by capt on 06/28/2008 19:41:03






Comment by capt on 06/28/2008 19:44:23
I was thinking, Bill wouldn't be so pissed if he didn't already know HRC was not going to join Barack on the ticket.



I think the dynamics support the conclusion HRC will NOT be the VP.



That is good news, if I'm right. . . . .

Comment by livingonli on 06/28/2008 20:32:29
http://images.icanhascheezburger.com/completestore/2008/6/14/128579332675690986.jpg




The spirit of Oolong lives on.

Comment by BobR on 06/28/2008 20:36:32
I've been trying to watch a show on the FreeMasons on the Discovery Channel. It is ha-AWWW-ful...



"Some people believe..."

"Some claim..."



um... how about "some facts"??

Comment by capt on 06/28/2008 20:55:24
I'm watching the same show. . . .





Comment by capt on 06/28/2008 21:00:02


"This fanciful claim is supposedly proven by Masonic references to pagan Egypt"



So SOLIDLY against the real god?





Comment by capt on 06/28/2008 21:07:07
"Ripperologist?"



I thought that was someone that took a huge drag on the huka?









Comment by BobR on 06/28/2008 21:33:14
Quote by capt:

I'm watching the same show. . . .





You have a lot more patience for bad journalism than I do.



I quit when after a 1/2 hour, they had covered maybe 10 minutes of material, most of it 3rd hand heresay. I was hoping for a bit more substance and a LOT less padding...

Comment by Raine on 06/28/2008 21:39:37
It is Caprinhia Time! (this is for all our new members! Please feel free to add your own in there!)

Comment by Raine on 06/28/2008 21:42:50
Quote by Random:

*clears throat*



:rofl:







Comment by livingonli on 06/28/2008 21:44:14
Has anyone heard from Shelagh lately?

Comment by capt on 06/28/2008 21:44:52
Quote by BobR:

Quote by capt:

I'm watching the same show. . . .





You have a lot more patience for bad journalism than I do.



I quit when after a 1/2 hour, they had covered maybe 10 minutes of material, most of it 3rd hand heresay. I was hoping for a bit more substance and a LOT less padding...




It is just background noise. Trying to stay busy so I'm only catching bits and pieces. When I really watch something I record it first so I can jump the breaks - I can't stand commercials AAARRRRHHHHHH!





Comment by capt on 06/28/2008 21:53:17
I'm pretty sure the freemason show is a parody? A SNL skit where they are trying to act badly is funny because of these guys . . .













Comment by capt on 06/28/2008 22:01:38
Comment by livingonli on 06/28/2008 22:03:38
It's gotten very dark here and they turned on the lights at Shea Stadium.

Comment by livingonli on 06/28/2008 22:43:25
And now we have a thunderstorm here.

Comment by Random on 06/28/2008 22:45:16
Quote by Raine:

Quote by Random:

*clears throat*



:rofl:







you mock me Madam Raine?

Comment by capt on 06/28/2008 22:48:03
http://bp1.blogger.com/_MS7_pHb7lpQ/SGa_XDxdFgI/AAAAAAAABvU/6ZHMY0yCrrU/s400/P1000058.jpg




This is Bright Eye's - she is a daddy's girl

Comment by capt on 06/28/2008 22:51:28
http://bp3.blogger.com/_MS7_pHb7lpQ/SGbAHwKUu1I/AAAAAAAABvc/N529OKHzl1s/s400/P1000036.jpg




And this is her sister Pretty Paws.



Both were hand raised and are litter mates so really sisters.