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Constructive or Destructive?
Author: Raine    Date: 06/17/2010 12:38:31

Yesterday I wrote in the comments of the blog the following:
Thom just said he was GLAD to hear the Nat Guard was being deployed. I found that disturbing to hear coming from him as I have known What that they were there right from the start. It was weeks - WEEKS ago that he deployed those 17,000 service members to the gulf. Hell -- I posted a link from the DoD yesterday.

And here lies a big problem, for me. Progressives like Thom, (and others - like Olberman), complain about the lack of reporting from our media, and claim to be the ones who are willing to carry the torch, and yet, in this case, they have done the opposite.

It seems as tho suddenly the President isn't progressive enough for them, and they have chosen to not do the research that the MSM should be doing, the same research they claim they want to do.

I could be wrong here, but I am terribly disappointed by the progressive media at this point. I would have hoped that they would have gotten this information out there.
There is a difference between constructive and destructive criticism. The 2 are not mutually exclusive to one another. There are legitimate concerns to be had with this President, but I have found in the past year and a half, that when I hear something on the radio or TV that sounds just awful, a little research goes a long way. Many times I find that what I heard and reality are two very different things.

What I said yesterday was aimed at smart people who I do trust, like Thom Hartman. For months Thom has said that he wanted President Obama to be like FDR, even playing wonderful clips of the great President. Imagine my surprise when yesterday he exclaimed "I don't want him to be like FDR, I want him to be like Jimmy Carter" So which is it? It isn't Just Thom, so I apologize if I seem to be picking on him, I'm not. It's just starting to seem like everyone has an image of what they want the President to be as opposed to the person he has shown himself to be. It's come to full bore on our own Stephanie Miller show. This week has been painful to listen to. People in the middle of the debate have legitimate claims and opinions, but to shut it down with the accusation that the other doesn't allow dissent is simply another way to shut down debate. It's strawman, and I want better than that from ALL of the people I love in progressive radio. I rely on them for insight as well as information.

I would like this president to be the greatest President he can be. I had hoped that progressive media would help him do that by getting truth out there, but I am starting to see that sometimes instead of truth, there is a selective appropriation of information to fit the agenda. Now, I understand that this is most likely not done in malice, but it seems to be happening nonetheless.

I have even heard it suggested by people on the left that we haven't accepted help from other countries, Sadly that seems to be a talking point that originated on the right as witnessed by the former half term governor of Alaska. The problem is, it's not true.
In late May, the administration accepted Mexico’s offer of two skimmers and 13,779 feet of boom; a Dutch offer of three sets of Koseq sweeping arms, which attach to the sides of ships and gather oil; and eight skimming systems offered by Norway.
One can question why it took so long for that help. I had wondered that myself, but I have come to a belief that perhaps people were told that this wasn't as bad as it really is. BP is telling lies, and no one seems to know what to believe. Gone under the radar is that Eric holder is investigating, and we won't know anything regarding criminal negligence for some time, considering this alleged crime is still happening. There are estimates that these fines could be over 60 billion dollars.

Maybe the problem is simply that people are rightfully panicking.

As far as offshore drilling goes, this president has always said it was part of a comprehensive plan to change our energy policy in this nation, something that every President says they'll do, but never seems to have the political fortitude or courage to back it up. But here is a little information Campaign Promise 458: Invest in all types of alternative energy Result? Promise Kept. For the first time, to my knowledge, a President actually acknowledged Peak Oil in a White House address
"...oil is a finite resource. We consume more than 20% of the world's oil, but have less than 2% of the world's oil reserves. And that's part of the reason oil companies are drilling a mile beneath the surface of the ocean - because we're running out of places to drill on land and in shallow water.

For decades, we have known the days of cheap and easily accessible oil were numbered. For decades, we have talked and talked about the need to end America's century-long addiction to fossil fuels. And for decades, we have failed to act with the sense of urgency that this challenge requires. Time and again, the path forward has been blocked - not only by oil industry lobbyists, but also by a lack of political courage and candor.

The consequences of our inaction are now in plain sight. Countries like China are investing in clean energy jobs and industries that should be here in America. Each day, we send nearly $1 billion of our wealth to foreign countries for their oil. And today, as we look to the Gulf, we see an entire way of life being threatened by a menacing cloud of black crude.

We cannot consign our children to this future. The tragedy unfolding on our coast is the most painful and powerful reminder yet that the time to embrace a clean energy future is now. Now is the moment for this generation to embark on a national mission to unleash American innovation and seize control of our own destiny."
He's also proposing a major Wetland restoration project for the Gulf. The Gulf's wetlands are like kidney's, you cannot survive with out them. These are amazing undertakings that should IMO, be supported.

Had we made the changes Jimmy Carter wanted we might not be where we are today, but the reality is this: this is where we are today. And while it is good to push the President (he asked Americans to do so) I think it is important to know the facts. Too many times I have heard something I did not like come from the White house only to find out a few days later that I was misinformed. This is from both the left and the right. I do think staff changes need to be made, but not out of retribution or blame for something. Maybe Ken Salazar should be fired, and even Rahm Emanuel - but I don't think or even know whether it will help or hinder what is happening NOW. This is really that big of a crisis.

After giving a scathing review of the Presidents Speech the other night, Keith Olberman tweeted the follwing:
Then I will say, more or less: this is easily the smartest political leader I have ever seen, as good a political public speaker as I've heard, + last October I was privileged along with 11 other newspeople to spend 2 hours with him as he showed extemporaneous mastery of every one of two dozen topics fired at him by us in random order. I left the room wondering if we had ever before actually elected a president who was one of the 1,000 smartest people in the country (or maybe 100, or 10) as we had now. I believe in him and in his presidency and he has frequently achieved success (in health care reform, particularly) by doing that for which I criticized him. I hope that is again the case now because the Gulf Speech was not up to his standards nor did it express his mastery of policy. And if you will stop watching because I said this, I'll be very sorry, but you will have been watching for the wrong reason. I am not, have not been, and will not be, any politician's, nor any president's, spokesman.
It seems to me that once again, this President is not meeting the standards that people in the media seem to want to set upon him. As BobR said yesterday , this was not the speech of a lifetime, but it had very important information. And I believe it resonated with the people who needed it too the most: The people of the Gulf -- including the Fisherman's prayer. Seeing the next day he actually secured a 20 Billion dollar fund from BP was an amazing accomplishment. $100 million dollars for the unemployed workers on oil rigs was equally astounding. These are good things in light of a catastrophe that may change the way we live forever.

So no, I don't want another FDR, Nixon, Carter or Lincoln. I want President Obama to be able to be the best president we could have. He is smarter than me, and I like that. I like that I am challenged by the things he does and it forces me to think instead of react, which is what happened during the previous administration. This is a different time, and a different person with FAR different motives. That is important to remember. They are not the same. NOT at all.

We need all the truth out there from the media, not just what we want to see. Not having the truth is exactly what got us into this mess in the first place. My hope today was to provide constructive criticism, and not shut down debate. I really want to know what you think.

and
Raine



 

62 comments (Latest Comment: 06/18/2010 02:40:38 by Raine)
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Comment by TriSec on 06/17/2010 12:48:30
Morning, small people! Did you get your lives back yet?





Comment by Will in Chicago on 06/17/2010 12:55:31
Good morning, bloggers! Thank you for an interesting blog.



I read the speech and was not quite satisfied. However, I know that a lot of work has to be done behind the scenes. So, I will judge President Obama by the fruits of his labor. (Another problem is Congress -- we have too many Democrats who would have been Republicans in another era. Perhaps Obama can take a page from LBJ and pressure people in his own party, as I doubt the Republicans would go along with Obama if he asked everyone to sing the Star-Spangled Banner at the same time.)

Comment by Will in Chicago on 06/17/2010 12:59:41
Raine, the bonus link goes to reactions to Obama's speech form September, 2009/

Comment by Raine on 06/17/2010 13:01:42
Quote by Will in Chicago:

Raine, the bonus link goes to reactions to Obama's speech form September, 2009/


Aww crap. Thanks Will!



Sigh. I'll remove it!

Comment by wickedpam on 06/17/2010 13:06:31
Morning



It stuck me as I was reading the blog this morning that, what if progressive radio was conscienceiously (sp) working at not being what Fake News was during the bush years. If that's the case then they are over shooting the mark by miles cause they are doing more harm then good at this point

Comment by Raine on 06/17/2010 13:10:51
Quote by wickedpam:

Morning



It stuck me as I was reading the blog this morning that, what if progressive radio was conscienceiously (sp) working at not being what Fake News was during the bush years. If that's the case then they are over shooting the mark by miles cause they are doing more harm then good at this point


I think that's a good observation, I don;t think any of it is being done with malice or harmful intent. I will continue to listen because as I said I want the insight and the information - and entertainment.



It just seems like something has been terribly off lately. Maybe it's me -- I am more than willing to accept that. But I really had to get this one off the ol' chest.

Comment by wickedpam on 06/17/2010 13:16:38
Quote by Raine:

Quote by wickedpam:

Morning



It stuck me as I was reading the blog this morning that, what if progressive radio was conscienceiously (sp) working at not being what Fake News was during the bush years. If that's the case then they are over shooting the mark by miles cause they are doing more harm then good at this point


I think that's a good observation, I don;t think any of it is being done with malice or harmful intent. I will continue to listen because as I said I want the insight and the information - and entertainment.



It just seems like something has been terribly off lately. Maybe it's me -- I am more than willing to accept that. But I really had to get this one off the ol' chest.






No, its not just you - I maybe can get through the first hour of Thom but them I have to switch to something else can I'm tired of the complaining.

Comment by Raine on 06/17/2010 13:22:46
Quote by Will in Chicago:

Good morning, bloggers! Thank you for an interesting blog.



I read the speech and was not quite satisfied. However, I know that a lot of work has to be done behind the scenes. So, I will judge President Obama by the fruits of his labor. (Another problem is Congress -- we have too many Democrats who would have been Republicans in another era. Perhaps Obama can take a page from LBJ and pressure people in his own party, as I doubt the Republicans would go along with Obama if he asked everyone to sing the Star-Spangled Banner at the same time.)
Exactly, Will. The Senate is a total disaster.



Even DiFi is on the fence regarding the Energy bill. It's a total WTF moment that I seem to have daily with that chamber of congress.



Yesterday On Facebook I had a very cathartic rant after seeing Senator Thune complain that the Adress should have happened a lot sooner.
F*ck you John Thune. Seriously F*CK you.



You wanna go to the should have happened sooner time machine? Fine, let's do it. We should have Listened to Jimmy Carter back in 1979. We didn't. Reagan took the Solar panels OFF the WHite house as one of his first acts in office. You wanna bitch about a president not giving a speech soon enough after 30 years of this bullshit?



NOW is the time to go forward in this country to do what we have to do.



Thune can go to hell for all I care. It is HIS party that have been trying to block cap and trade, and HIS party that wanted less regulation. It was HIS party that wanted government so small they could drown it in a bathtub. It was HIS party that made it so we were not able to handle this disaster. It was HIS party that allowed oil companies to fill out their own inspection reports to the MMS, it was his party that let the MMS become a haven for corruption.

SCREW Thune and his ilk.


I know most people here have read this, but it still feels so good.



Comment by Raine on 06/17/2010 13:29:24
You know I forgot to mention in the Blog today that the president also made sure that BP would not be giving any dividend payment still at least the end of the year.

Comment by Raine on 06/17/2010 13:33:10
Wether or not it was expected, I think this is huge. He deserves serious props for this.

Comment by TriSec on 06/17/2010 13:34:40
Always late to the party, because I pick up the podcasts instead of watching live.



KO was talking about how BP won't allow the workers to wear safety equipment when working in the Gulf. A couple of notes from first-hand experience.



I used to be an EMT. They wouldn't even let us go *near* a victim, even if we could see him with blood gushing out of a wound, unless the accident site was secure and we were wearing the necessary protective gear. This was drilled into us from the very beginning at school; don't kill yourself to save someone.



I still build plastic scale models. I have a tiny workbench and cans of compressed, nontoxic gas that I use for my airbrush. I *always* wear a respirator, even when handling miniscule amounts of paint.



Rachel mentioned it on her show last week...she was out in the Gulf and all you can see and smell is oil. That can't be healthy for anyone.



Why doesn't somebody make a hot-oil sundae and see if BP execs will eat it, since they're so sure the oil isn't dangerous?



Comment by wickedpam on 06/17/2010 13:38:23
I do enjoy the dry wit of the Grayson

Comment by Raine on 06/17/2010 13:39:49


Comment by Raine on 06/17/2010 13:44:23
Grayson is hilarious.

Comment by Scoopster on 06/17/2010 13:49:28
Morning all! Back at the office today, still a bit sore and stiff but we expected that.. Also, let me say that crossing a busy street with a bum leg is REALLY FRICKIN' TOUGH!



I think I'm gonna tell my boss that I want the day off tomorrow to get some extra rest.

Comment by Raine on 06/17/2010 13:50:45
*sigh*





Comment by Raine on 06/17/2010 13:52:13
Why am I having Primary Flashbacks?

Comment by TriSec on 06/17/2010 13:59:19
I’ve got another observation…on these artificial islands they want to build along the coast (and were debunked on TRMS last night….)



I’ve seen it happen locally, or something similar. It’s not going to work. Back in the 70s, there was almost an interstate built through the salt marshes of Revere and Saugus. They left an enormous embankment there for about 15 years. In the late 80s, the environmental lobby in this Commonwealth had the brilliant idea to bulldoze the embankment and take all the sand and replenish Revere Beach, which was badly eroded at that time.



So they spent an entire summer trucking all the sand to the beach. In the end, it looked great; the marsh was open again, and the beach was wide and flat and clean.



Until the first winter storm. All that new sand was swept out to sea, which ended up creating a new sand bar and hazard to local navigation, and the beach and seawall were pounded by storms that year. (Fortunately, the marsh did better.)



Over time, nature did redeposit most of that sand back on the beach. But it all took time, and messing with mother nature didn’t end the way they intended.



Comment by Raine on 06/17/2010 14:05:07
GAH!!!! Did Jim listen to what the president said? Let me REPOST THIS in hopes that Jim is reading.
"...oil is a finite resource. We consume more than 20% of the world's oil, but have less than 2% of the world's oil reserves. And that's part of the reason oil companies are drilling a mile beneath the surface of the ocean - because we're running out of places to drill on land and in shallow water.



For decades, we have known the days of cheap and easily accessible oil were numbered. For decades, we have talked and talked about the need to end America's century-long addiction to fossil fuels. And for decades, we have failed to act with the sense of urgency that this challenge requires. Time and again, the path forward has been blocked - not only by oil industry lobbyists, but also by a lack of political courage and candor.



The consequences of our inaction are now in plain sight. Countries like China are investing in clean energy jobs and industries that should be here in America. Each day, we send nearly $1 billion of our wealth to foreign countries for their oil. And today, as we look to the Gulf, we see an entire way of life being threatened by a menacing cloud of black crude.



We cannot consign our children to this future. The tragedy unfolding on our coast is the most painful and powerful reminder yet that the time to embrace a clean energy future is now. Now is the moment for this generation to embark on a national mission to unleash American innovation and seize control of our own destiny."
I bold this because someone like Jim who KNOWS about the problem of peak oil should know that until we can change our energy policy, we are stuck in this quagmire.



Getting off fossil fuels is about MORE than oil and gas. Look around your desk, look at all the plastics in front of you RIGHT now. Look at your computer, look at you cd's. It's more than just gas an oil as a fuel source.



We cannot just STOP using oil and gas without an alternative infrastructure in place, and time is running out. We don;t have a choice right now, as the president said, we are drilling offshore like this, in deep waters becuase we are running out of places to drill.



We can't stop this until we have an infrastructure in place to replace drilling. Until then we still have energy needs to be met in this nations. Unless EVERYONE starts making SERIOUS sacrifices, this is the way we have to go. Are you willing to make sacrifices?



It may be small, and it may not be enough, but Bob and I have chosen to not have 2 cars. We have also chosen to not have children. We rent and have no plans to buy a new house. We are by far not perfect, nor people that should be used as a gold standard for sacrifice. We do what we can, and will probably do more because we can. We cook at home, we grow vegetables.



But in order for offshore drilling to stop now will require such drastic measures FOR and FROM the citizens of this country -- I don;t believe the moral will is there. The president is trying, but until people understand WHY this all hasn't stopped RIGHT NOW is disingenuous.



We are at PEAK OIL. This deepwater drilling is the result of PEAK OIL. Jim HAS to know that.

Comment by Raine on 06/17/2010 14:06:45
Quote by TriSec:

I’ve got another observation…on these artificial islands they want to build along the coast (and were debunked on TRMS last night….)



I’ve seen it happen locally, or something similar. It’s not going to work. Back in the 70s, there was almost an interstate built through the salt marshes of Revere and Saugus. They left an enormous embankment there for about 15 years. In the late 80s, the environmental lobby in this Commonwealth had the brilliant idea to bulldoze the embankment and take all the sand and replenish Revere Beach, which was badly eroded at that time.



So they spent an entire summer trucking all the sand to the beach. In the end, it looked great; the marsh was open again, and the beach was wide and flat and clean.



Until the first winter storm. All that new sand was swept out to sea, which ended up creating a new sand bar and hazard to local navigation, and the beach and seawall were pounded by storms that year. (Fortunately, the marsh did better.)



Over time, nature did redeposit most of that sand back on the beach. But it all took time, and messing with mother nature didn’t end the way they intended.

I think the levees along the Mississippi River and the flooding a few years ago proved Mother nature does not like being messed with.



Comment by TriSec on 06/17/2010 14:10:11
BTW, don't you all love my congresscritter? [Ed Markey, D-MA. No, really; I'm in his district!]





Comment by Raine on 06/17/2010 14:13:10
We are at endgame. The president is trying to END our dependance on oil. I am saddened that people don't see that this administration acknowledged that.



We cannot stop drilling until we have an infrastructure in place. This is a sad, uncomfortable reality. I hate it.



If that makes me look like I'm pro-drilling then I think many people have been missing my point.

Comment by Raine on 06/17/2010 14:14:38
Quote by TriSec:

BTW, don't you all love my congresscritter? [Ed Markey, D-MA. No, really; I'm in his district!]





I do!



Isn't it nice to feel so proud of your representative? I miss John Lewis. I am still becoming aquatinted with ours.

Comment by Raine on 06/17/2010 14:16:08
YAY caller! I agree, with her very much. This is getting really defensive again.

Comment by Raine on 06/17/2010 14:28:38
2.5 millions of barrels a day? That is what the last caller just said.



I am not sure where that number came from. This isn't good, but according to treehugger, it's 2.5 Million GALLONS (not barrels) a day.



Goodness... these might seem like small details -- but they are NOT.





Comment by wickedpam on 06/17/2010 14:32:13
Quote by Raine:

We are at endgame. The president is trying to END our dependance on oil. I am saddened that people don't see that this administration acknowledged that.



We cannot stop drilling until we have an infrastructure in place. This is a sad, uncomfortable reality. I hate it.



If that makes me look like I'm pro-drilling then I think many people have been missing my point.






I don't think it make you or anyone who says it look pro drilling - technologies overlap - they always have. A good analogy is phones - when we we're growing up I'm sure everyone remembers their rotary phones - as we got older touch tone phased out the old dials now we seem to be transitioning from everyone having a "home" phone to people just having personal phones. Some of us still have corded wall phones for land lines but there is a growing number who have "cut" the cord as they say.



It all takes time - I wish people were more motivated to come up with new tech a little faster tho - I'm still waitin' on my flying car the Jetson's promised

Comment by Raine on 06/17/2010 14:41:03
Quote by wickedpam:

Quote by Raine:

We are at endgame. The president is trying to END our dependance on oil. I am saddened that people don't see that this administration acknowledged that.



We cannot stop drilling until we have an infrastructure in place. This is a sad, uncomfortable reality. I hate it.



If that makes me look like I'm pro-drilling then I think many people have been missing my point.






I don't think it make you or anyone who says it look pro drilling - technologies overlap - they always have. A good analogy is phones - when we we're growing up I'm sure everyone remembers their rotary phones - as we got older touch tone phased out the old dials now we seem to be transitioning from everyone having a "home" phone to people just having personal phones. Some of us still have corded wall phones for land lines but there is a growing number who have "cut" the cord as they say.



It all takes time - I wish people were more motivated to come up with new tech a little faster tho - I'm still waitin' on my flying car the Jetson's promised
Will this do?









But like I said, until we have the infrastructure in place, we can't use it. WE had a chance with the electric care, and corporate America got RID of it. I strongly suggest people go watch this movie, if they have not seen it yet, *Who killed the Electric car*



It's a good allegory to what our nation has become.

Comment by Raine on 06/17/2010 14:51:39
Sonya Sotomayor was liberal. The right hated it, and the left didn't want to believe it.

Comment by TriSec on 06/17/2010 14:52:46
If alternative energy was small, shiny, connected to the internet, and you could download widgets and text from it, we'd have had it by now.



Comment by Raine on 06/17/2010 14:56:42
I'm afraid too. We should all be afraid.



But dammit I am not going to live in fear, and I am not going to react in fear. The fact that BP has been told to not give dividends is a clear shot across the bow that they cannot go bankrupt to get out of this.



At least that is how I see it.

Comment by Raine on 06/17/2010 14:57:22
Quote by TriSec:

If alternative energy was small, shiny, connected to the internet, and you could download widgets and text from it, we'd have had it by now.



FTW.

Comment by Raine on 06/17/2010 15:01:36
Rep Joe Barton apologizes to BP....
So I’m only speaking for myself, I’m not speaking for anybody else, but I apologize, I do not want to live in a country where any time a citizen for a corporation does something that is legitimately wrong is subject to some sort of political pressure that is again in my words amounts to shakedown. So I apologize.





May he also rot in hell.

Comment by Raine on 06/17/2010 15:03:10
I am a citizen of THIS UNITED STATES OF AMERICA.



There are NO f*cking Citizens of a corporation -- period. FRUCK you Joe BArton and you on the knees apology to BP.









Comment by wickedpam on 06/17/2010 15:06:30
Raine



That was a little like a convergance of a sit and spin, weedwacker and air hockey puck

Comment by wickedpam on 06/17/2010 15:10:27
okay would someone explain cap and trade in terms I can understand? I don't get what it is

Comment by livingonli on 06/17/2010 15:22:21
Good morning everyone.



Maybe we need a true populist revolt out there in numbers telling corporate America to go suck it. There are more people who feel this way than the pro-corporate teabaggers and it would expose them as the frauds they are.

Comment by Raine on 06/17/2010 15:28:08
Quote by wickedpam:

okay would someone explain cap and trade in terms I can understand? I don't get what it is


The Facts of Cap-and-Trade from Clean Energy Works on Vimeo.



Comment by Raine on 06/17/2010 15:30:52
and here is a Wikipedia post on it. (that guy is a bit annoying, I admit)

Comment by TriSec on 06/17/2010 15:39:39
Wiki Sez:



A central authority (usually a governmental body) sets a limit or cap on the amount of a pollutant that can be emitted. The limit or cap is allocated or sold to firms in the form of emissions permits which represent the right to emit or discharge a specific volume of the specified pollutant. Firms are required to hold a number of permits (or credits) equivalent to their emissions. The total amount of permits cannot exceed the cap, limiting total emissions to that level.



Firms that need to increase their emission permits must buy permits from those who require fewer permits (Stavins 2001, p 4.). The transfer of permits is referred to as a trade. In effect, the buyer is paying a charge for polluting, while the seller is being rewarded for having reduced emissions. Thus, in theory, those who can reduce emissions most cheaply will do so, achieving the pollution reduction at the lowest cost to society...

















Comment by wickedpam on 06/17/2010 15:50:42
Thanks guys



I get the idea behind, sounds a little jumbled like trading Pokemon cards but I faith it'll get more streamlined as time goes

Comment by livingonli on 06/17/2010 15:54:54
Oh, so now Dick Armey now wants to hide tea party associations. I guess the brand name has kind of taken a dive lately.

Comment by BobR on 06/17/2010 15:55:08




My mornings have been extra busy lately...

Comment by wickedpam on 06/17/2010 16:09:41
Quote by livingonli:

Oh, so now Dick Armey now wants to hide tea party associations. I guess the brand name has kind of taken a dive lately.






to me it sounds like they are cowards who want to hide what they are

Comment by livingonli on 06/17/2010 16:11:27
Quote by wickedpam:

Quote by livingonli:

Oh, so now Dick Armey now wants to hide tea party associations. I guess the brand name has kind of taken a dive lately.






to me it sounds like they are cowards who want to hide what they are


Look at how they have scrubbed Angle's website to hide her ultra right-wing views. It looks they don't want the people of Nevada to know that she wants Alcohol illegal.

Comment by wickedpam on 06/17/2010 16:17:30
Quote by livingonli:

Quote by wickedpam:

Quote by livingonli:

Oh, so now Dick Armey now wants to hide tea party associations. I guess the brand name has kind of taken a dive lately.






to me it sounds like they are cowards who want to hide what they are


Look at how they have scrubbed Angle's website to hide her ultra right-wing views. It looks they don't want the people of Nevada to know that she wants Alcohol illegal.




This will never fly in Las Vegas and Reno alone! I would kill tourism more then trying to make it a family desintation did.



Comment by wickedpam on 06/17/2010 16:18:32
*sigh* why do I smell a Steph/Thom feud brewing?

Comment by livingonli on 06/17/2010 16:30:10
Quote by wickedpam:

*sigh* why do I smell a Steph/Thom feud brewing?


Don't you hate it when the parents fight?

Comment by wickedpam on 06/17/2010 17:02:33
Yeah, I do. I know not everyone holds the same opinions but still - this is just getting stupid. Those idiots on Faux can hold it together is it the dumb factor at that network?

Comment by Raine on 06/17/2010 17:03:12
Guess who finally resurfaced? The most hated Dick in the world.



Cheney. That vile motherf8cker.

Comment by Raine on 06/17/2010 17:03:58
Quote by wickedpam:

*sigh* why do I smell a Steph/Thom feud brewing?


What did I miss?