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The perception of crime
Author: Raine
Date: 07/23/2009 12:39:22
Back on election night, 2000, I was driving home from NYC with a friend. We were in a late 80's model Buick, Maroon 4 door. It was an old car, and it finally had a heart attack on the NYS Thruway near Yonkers. The car passed away 150 feet from the exit. It was pretty late at night; I recall it being dark. We called a friend that I knew in the area and went back to the car to wait. He had a truck and a chain and would help us get the car off the road and put us up for the night. It would be about a half hour to 45 minutes till he came to get us. I fell asleep in the front seat of the car. My friend stayed vigilant and waited behind the steering wheel.
I heard a tapping on the window. It was a State Trooper. I thought this was great. We didn't have to worry about kooks on the highway this late at night. My friend rolled down the window and the police officer asked him to get out of the car. I drowsily awakened as he opened the door to get out. The friend was pulling out his wallet to show his license and registration. Then the police officer shines his flashlight in my eyes. He told the friend to please walk to the back of the car. He then walked around the front of the vehicle toward my window. I started at that point to get a funny feeling about what was going on.
The officer told me to roll down the window, and asked for my identification. He then proceeded to ask me why we were sitting on the Thruway at nearly midnight. I began to explain the story. He interrupted me and asked what was in my backpack in the back seat of the car. I told him it was art supplies and work-out clothes. At this point, he asked my friend to walk over and stand near the trooper vehicle. Now I knew something was definitely wrong. He told me to get my bag. I proceeded to ask him why. Once again he said "Ma'am, please open that bag." Again, I asked 'Why, officer? We are waiting for a friend to pick us up' . He asked a third time, now seemingly irritated at me. I started shaking from fear and nervousness. I really didn't get what was happening.
I got the bag, he opened it up, and I started to tell him that he did not have a right to do that. From over near the officers vehicle, I hear me friend calmly tell say: 'Raine, don't.' He shook his head telling me to let it go and not push the situation. I was really confused, as what this officer was doing was a search of the vehicle for what appeared to me no reason. He went thru my bag, with my art supplies, and my gym clothes, and then he found what I forgot was in the bag. A weekly pill ox filled with the vitamins and things I was taking to stay healthy as I was working out. He shined the light in my face again. At this point he asked me to tell him specifically what each of these pills were for. He asked me, why should I believe you, and I immediately stood attention, asking him why shouldn't you? We haven't done anything wrong, and you are treating us as tho we have.' I was ready to ask him for his name and badge number when again, I heard me friend say again, 'Raine don't'.
The officer proceeded to check out the rest of the car. I was shaking with fear, I really was. When he finally got done searching the vehicle, he said that he was going to call a tow company. Apparently he forgot the fact that we both told him that we were waiting for a friend to pick us up, and since we were only a few yards from the exit, he would tow us with his pick up. My friend asked if he could talk to the officer, and reminded him of this. The officer would have none of it, citing Thruway laws, etc. We were towed, literally 150 feet, at a cost of $150 dollars. My friend was issued a ticket for parking illegally, but no arrests were made that night.
I forgot to mention to you, my friend is a black man. I am a white woman. The officer? Also a black man. He proceeded to tell me that we literally got caught 'driving while black' - or in my case - 'driving with black'. Little did I know how close we both came to sitting in a trooper barrack that night. I was furious, scared and angry for the rest of the evening - so much so that the only thing that could bring me out of it was those wretched election results. Did the officer have a right to do to us what he did? I don't know. The perception of crime is very different from one person to the next. I saw no danger, but evidently the cop did. My friend probably saved me a lot of grief asking me to be quiet.
To this day it bothers me. Seeing what happened to Professor Gates bothers me. I do not like that we live in a day and age when the law can simply say they perceive a crime in order to justify the violation of privacy, be it a gym bag filled with stinky clothes, a trunk of a car, or one's house. Police may have to do their job, but they shouldn't be breaking the law to do it. I learned it can happen to anyone.
"I think it's fair to say, number one, any of us would be pretty angry," Obama said. "Number two, that the Cambridge police acted stupidly in arresting somebody when there was already proof that they were in their own home. And number three — what I think we know separate and apart from this incident — is that there is a long history in this country of African-Americans and Latinos being stopped by law enforcement disproportionately, and that's just a fact." -- President Barack Obama
:peace: and
Raine
I heard a tapping on the window. It was a State Trooper. I thought this was great. We didn't have to worry about kooks on the highway this late at night. My friend rolled down the window and the police officer asked him to get out of the car. I drowsily awakened as he opened the door to get out. The friend was pulling out his wallet to show his license and registration. Then the police officer shines his flashlight in my eyes. He told the friend to please walk to the back of the car. He then walked around the front of the vehicle toward my window. I started at that point to get a funny feeling about what was going on.
The officer told me to roll down the window, and asked for my identification. He then proceeded to ask me why we were sitting on the Thruway at nearly midnight. I began to explain the story. He interrupted me and asked what was in my backpack in the back seat of the car. I told him it was art supplies and work-out clothes. At this point, he asked my friend to walk over and stand near the trooper vehicle. Now I knew something was definitely wrong. He told me to get my bag. I proceeded to ask him why. Once again he said "Ma'am, please open that bag." Again, I asked 'Why, officer? We are waiting for a friend to pick us up' . He asked a third time, now seemingly irritated at me. I started shaking from fear and nervousness. I really didn't get what was happening.
I got the bag, he opened it up, and I started to tell him that he did not have a right to do that. From over near the officers vehicle, I hear me friend calmly tell say: 'Raine, don't.' He shook his head telling me to let it go and not push the situation. I was really confused, as what this officer was doing was a search of the vehicle for what appeared to me no reason. He went thru my bag, with my art supplies, and my gym clothes, and then he found what I forgot was in the bag. A weekly pill ox filled with the vitamins and things I was taking to stay healthy as I was working out. He shined the light in my face again. At this point he asked me to tell him specifically what each of these pills were for. He asked me, why should I believe you, and I immediately stood attention, asking him why shouldn't you? We haven't done anything wrong, and you are treating us as tho we have.' I was ready to ask him for his name and badge number when again, I heard me friend say again, 'Raine don't'.
The officer proceeded to check out the rest of the car. I was shaking with fear, I really was. When he finally got done searching the vehicle, he said that he was going to call a tow company. Apparently he forgot the fact that we both told him that we were waiting for a friend to pick us up, and since we were only a few yards from the exit, he would tow us with his pick up. My friend asked if he could talk to the officer, and reminded him of this. The officer would have none of it, citing Thruway laws, etc. We were towed, literally 150 feet, at a cost of $150 dollars. My friend was issued a ticket for parking illegally, but no arrests were made that night.
I forgot to mention to you, my friend is a black man. I am a white woman. The officer? Also a black man. He proceeded to tell me that we literally got caught 'driving while black' - or in my case - 'driving with black'. Little did I know how close we both came to sitting in a trooper barrack that night. I was furious, scared and angry for the rest of the evening - so much so that the only thing that could bring me out of it was those wretched election results. Did the officer have a right to do to us what he did? I don't know. The perception of crime is very different from one person to the next. I saw no danger, but evidently the cop did. My friend probably saved me a lot of grief asking me to be quiet.
To this day it bothers me. Seeing what happened to Professor Gates bothers me. I do not like that we live in a day and age when the law can simply say they perceive a crime in order to justify the violation of privacy, be it a gym bag filled with stinky clothes, a trunk of a car, or one's house. Police may have to do their job, but they shouldn't be breaking the law to do it. I learned it can happen to anyone.
:peace: and
Raine
Comments:
Order comments Newest to Oldest Refresh Comments
Comment by 
wickedpam on 07/23/2009 12:55:30
wickedpam on 07/23/2009 12:55:30
MOrning :hug:
Not going to around today - community stuff and actual work to do
I'll try and drive by when I can!
Not going to around today - community stuff and actual work to do
I'll try and drive by when I can!
Comment by 
TriSec on 07/23/2009 13:11:53
TriSec on 07/23/2009 13:11:53
Morning, comrades!
Interesting story.....and curious what time will do to you. I bet if the exact same incident happened again, you'd be spending the night with the Staties.
I might have quietly said "Yes Officer" myself a while ago. But not today. Where's the warrant? Where's the probable cause? You can't search my car or me. And I don't need to show an ID, either.
Interesting story.....and curious what time will do to you. I bet if the exact same incident happened again, you'd be spending the night with the Staties.
I might have quietly said "Yes Officer" myself a while ago. But not today. Where's the warrant? Where's the probable cause? You can't search my car or me. And I don't need to show an ID, either.
Comment by 
Scoopster on 07/23/2009 13:22:37
Scoopster on 07/23/2009 13:22:37
Morning my dears! 
:hug:
Today was day three of Sports Talk Boston Under Siege, as the dipshit duo morning drive team monopolized their entire broadcast to continue their insults against Professor Gates and denials of police stupidity and subtle racial discrimination. I checked in periodically over two and a half hours to see if they were even bothering to discuss topics actually relating to the station's format, like the Lugo trade or the current Sox slump or even the slightly-less-but-still-annoying trade chatter about Toronto pitcher Roy Halliday.. not a word.
Personally I'm starting to like the idea of another sports talk station in Boston. At least it will give people an alternative to this wingnut blathering and hopefully lack of discussion about actual sports topics.
:hug:Today was day three of Sports Talk Boston Under Siege, as the dipshit duo morning drive team monopolized their entire broadcast to continue their insults against Professor Gates and denials of police stupidity and subtle racial discrimination. I checked in periodically over two and a half hours to see if they were even bothering to discuss topics actually relating to the station's format, like the Lugo trade or the current Sox slump or even the slightly-less-but-still-annoying trade chatter about Toronto pitcher Roy Halliday.. not a word.
Personally I'm starting to like the idea of another sports talk station in Boston. At least it will give people an alternative to this wingnut blathering and hopefully lack of discussion about actual sports topics.
Comment by TriSec on 07/23/2009 13:24:56
TriSec on 07/23/2009 13:24:56
An interesting take on the Healthcare debate from the Brits.
If Obama fails, it won't be personally damaging to him as much as it might to the United States as a whole and our perception throughout the world.
Essentially....we have a huge need, and a huge national crisis. Healthcare effects everything including the national economy. If we have this huge crisis, a mandate from the people, and leadership that wants it.....if we still can't get it done after all that, then we're going to look pretty foolish, aren't we?
If Obama fails, it won't be personally damaging to him as much as it might to the United States as a whole and our perception throughout the world.
Essentially....we have a huge need, and a huge national crisis. Healthcare effects everything including the national economy. If we have this huge crisis, a mandate from the people, and leadership that wants it.....if we still can't get it done after all that, then we're going to look pretty foolish, aren't we?
Comment by Scoopster on 07/23/2009 13:25:07
Scoopster on 07/23/2009 13:25:07
I think Jay-Z said it best.. "Well my glove compartment is locked so are the trunk in the back and I know my rights so you gon' need a warrant for that.... Nah, I ain't pass the bar but I know a little bit, enough that you won't illegally search my shit."
Comment by TriSec on 07/23/2009 13:26:57
TriSec on 07/23/2009 13:26:57
The only time I listen to sports radio in this city is when there is an actual game on. And even then, only in the car or during an important Sox game. (see the "Miracle of the Radio" recounted elsewhere in these pages.)
I have noted that WWZN (where the Celtics are) is playing liberal talk during the daytime hours.
You're still tangling with that busdriver, aren't you?
I have noted that WWZN (where the Celtics are) is playing liberal talk during the daytime hours.
You're still tangling with that busdriver, aren't you?
Comment by 
Random on 07/23/2009 13:31:00
Random on 07/23/2009 13:31:00
Random sleepy.
Comment by AuntAzalea on 07/23/2009 13:31:12
Great post Raine, I think one of the most poisonous things is when this scary stuff happens over and over to you across many years it changes how you feel and how you act in the world. Over my lifetime as a black woman with a black father and white mother, I have countless stories like that and what it has done is created fears that I have to fight. I am afraid of cops, I don't trust them - When some came to our door last year late at night with VJ off at work, I was completely panicked internally- I smiled and tried to be "non threatening" but I felt unsure of what my rights were with the whole "Bush patriot act" crap. Apparently a neighbor had complained about somebody doing construction late at night and pointed out my house - the cops drove by a construction site and came right to my house. It took me a week to feel fairly safe in my house.
When I am in a store I hold the receipt where it is easily visible afraid I will be stopped for stealing. When I go to my physical therapist I quickly and overly brightly say hello to the secretary because of the looks I get from the waiting room (the I better move my purse closer looks).
Of course just being female white, black or brown has a whole set of safety rules on how to act in various life situations. In some ways it can be a total advantage -( if you had been two black men you'd probably still be in jail.
)and some ways not.
It is exhausting and I know it wears on my health ( I just see a cop and my blood pressure goes way up) but it is just a fact of life. I try not to let it rule my life - I don't allow fear to stop me from living wherever I want or going anywhere I want and I work everyday to let people see who I really am- silly, goofy,serious,flawed,etc.
Well you certainly got me started today- thanks again.
When I am in a store I hold the receipt where it is easily visible afraid I will be stopped for stealing. When I go to my physical therapist I quickly and overly brightly say hello to the secretary because of the looks I get from the waiting room (the I better move my purse closer looks).
Of course just being female white, black or brown has a whole set of safety rules on how to act in various life situations. In some ways it can be a total advantage -( if you had been two black men you'd probably still be in jail.
)and some ways not.It is exhausting and I know it wears on my health ( I just see a cop and my blood pressure goes way up) but it is just a fact of life. I try not to let it rule my life - I don't allow fear to stop me from living wherever I want or going anywhere I want and I work everyday to let people see who I really am- silly, goofy,serious,flawed,etc.
Well you certainly got me started today- thanks again.
Comment by 
Raine on 07/23/2009 13:31:42
Raine on 07/23/2009 13:31:42
Is Sarah Drunk tweeting again?
:huh:
judge investigation,destroy integrity of process&strip rights;Abuse WILL cont til leaks/friv filers r held accntble&press reports accurately
12 minutes ago from TwitterBerry
:huh:
Comment by Scoopster on 07/23/2009 13:33:20
No actually we had the shift change a month ago.. I actually like the afternoon drive show and heard there were guest hosts on the morning show for a while, so I was listening to last week. Then this thing with Gates happened.. and like Tuesday morning my walkman was tuned on the station overnight so when I turned it on BAM!.. same thing yesterday..
Today I decided I'd see if they were still beating this dead horse and sure enough.. I might write a complaint letter to the station manager about the garbage they're spweing and asking why these idiots are even on their station when they don't stick to the damn format.
Scoopster on 07/23/2009 13:33:20
Quote by TriSec:
The only time I listen to sports radio in this city is when there is an actual game on. And even then, only in the car or during an important Sox game. (see the "Miracle of the Radio" recounted elsewhere in these pages.)
I have noted that WWZN (where the Celtics are) is playing liberal talk during the daytime hours.
You're still tangling with that busdriver, aren't you?
No actually we had the shift change a month ago.. I actually like the afternoon drive show and heard there were guest hosts on the morning show for a while, so I was listening to last week. Then this thing with Gates happened.. and like Tuesday morning my walkman was tuned on the station overnight so when I turned it on BAM!.. same thing yesterday..
Today I decided I'd see if they were still beating this dead horse and sure enough.. I might write a complaint letter to the station manager about the garbage they're spweing and asking why these idiots are even on their station when they don't stick to the damn format.
Comment by Raine on 07/23/2009 13:35:33
Thanks. I know that experience was a real eye opener for me. It did change the way I percieve the police forever. I am lucky in way in that I am white -- and I hope that isn't taken the wrong way.
That night and over the next few days my friend explained to me that the officer, seeing a black man with a white woman is immediatly looking at things in a suspect way. I never even concieved that thought.
Raine on 07/23/2009 13:35:33
Quote by AuntAzalea:
Great post Raine, I think one of the most poisonous things is when this scary stuff happens over and over to you across many years it changes how you feel and how you act in the world. Over my lifetime as a black woman with a black father and white mother, I have countless stories like that and what it has done is created fears that I have to fight. I am afraid of cops, I don't trust them - When some came to our door last year late at night with Betsy off at work, I was completely panicked internally- I smiled and tried to be "non threatening" but I felt unsure of what my rights were with the whole "Bush patriot act" crap. Apparently a neighbor had complained about somebody doing construction late at night and pointed out my house - the cops drove by a construction site and came right to my house. It took me a week to feel fairly safe in my house.
When I am in a store I hold the receipt where it is easily visible afraid I will be stopped for stealing. When I go to my physical therapist I quickly and overly brightly say hello to the secretary because of the looks I get from the waiting room (the I better move my purse closer looks).
Of course just being female white, black or brown has a whole set of safety rules on how to act in various life situations. In some ways it can be a total advantage -( if you had been two black men you'd probably still be in jail.
It is exhausting and I know it wears on my health ( I just see a cop and my blood pressure goes way up) but it is just a fact of life. I try not to let it rule my life - I don't allow fear to stop me from living wherever I want or going anywhere I want and I work everyday to let people see who I really am- silly, goofy,serious,flawed,etc.
Well you certainly got me started today- thanks again.
Thanks. I know that experience was a real eye opener for me. It did change the way I percieve the police forever. I am lucky in way in that I am white -- and I hope that isn't taken the wrong way.
That night and over the next few days my friend explained to me that the officer, seeing a black man with a white woman is immediatly looking at things in a suspect way. I never even concieved that thought.
Comment by 
BobR on 07/23/2009 13:38:10
BobR on 07/23/2009 13:38:10
Sadly, law and court precedent have given the police a lot of lattitude with regards to what they can and can't do. If they believe you may be a suspect of a crime, they can enter private areas (whether it be a car or an apartment) and pursue the "suspect" or look for a weapon:
Reasonable Suspicion:
Criminal Procedure:
Immediate Pursuit:
Searches incident to a lawful arrest:
The problem of course is that the police abuse this leeway, and can claim that they were merely doing what they did because the person was a suspect, and they were interested in protecting their own safety, preventing escapte, blah blah blah....
Despite how we may personally feel about it, the law actually gves them enough lattitude to be assholes and get away with it.
Reasonable Suspicion:
Reasonable suspicion is a legal standard in United States law that a person has been, is, or is about to be engaged in criminal activity based on specific and articulable facts and inferences. It is the basis for an investigatory or Terry stop by the police and requires less evidence than probable cause, the legal requirement for arrests and warrants. Reasonable suspicion is evaluated using the "reasonable person" or "reasonable officer" standard, in which said person in the same circumstances could reasonably believe a person has been, is, or is about to be engaged in criminal activity; such suspicion is not a mere hunch. Police may also, based solely on reasonable suspicion of a threat to safety, frisk a suspect for weapons, but not for contraband like drugs. A combination of particular facts, even if each is individually innocuous, can form the basis of reasonable suspicion.
Criminal Procedure:
...The judicial interpretation of fundamental rights has allowed states considerable leeway in shaping their own criminal procedures. Although their procedural rules and statutes are similar in many respects, federal and state legislatures are responsible for their own criminal procedures, and procedures can vary from state to state.
State and federal governments may not limit the protections guaranteed by the Constitution, but they may expand them. An example of this principle may be seen in the automobile exception to the Constitution's search warrant requirement. Under the automobile exception, states may allow the warrantless search of an automobile if the police officer reasonably believes that the vehicle holds evidence of a crime. The Supreme Court has determined that this exception is not a violation of the Fourth Amendment because drivers have a "reduced expectation of privacy" and because a vehicle is inherently mobile.
[...]
The Fourth Amendment protects persons against unreasonable searches and seizures by law enforcement officers. Generally, a search warrant is required before an officer may search a person or place. This general requirement is waived for many searches and seizures, including a search incident to a lawful arrest, a stop and frisk for weapons, a seizure of items in plain view, a search of an automobile, a search consented to by the suspect, a search after a hot pursuit, and a search in exigent, or emergency, circumstances.
Immediate Pursuit:
This is also the legal term for the right of a police officer or private citizen to use extraordinary means with regard to criminals or "tortfeasors" who have just committed a crime or tort. Under this doctrine police may make warrantless searches of fleeing suspects or cross jurisdictional boundaries for fleeing suspects and private citizens may use reasonable force to retake property which has just been taken from them.
Searches incident to a lawful arrest:
In the United States, citizens are protected by the Fourth Amendment to the United States Constitution against unreasonable search and seizure. In most cases, a search warrant is required to perform a lawful search. An exception to this requirement is searches incident to a lawful arrest. This is also known as the Chimel Rule after the case that established it, Chimel v. California (1969). This rule permits an officer to perform a warrantless search during or immediately after a lawful arrest. This search is limited to only the person arrested and the area immediately surrounding the person in which the person may gain possession of a weapon, in some way effect an escape, or destroy or hide evidence.
The problem of course is that the police abuse this leeway, and can claim that they were merely doing what they did because the person was a suspect, and they were interested in protecting their own safety, preventing escapte, blah blah blah....
Despite how we may personally feel about it, the law actually gves them enough lattitude to be assholes and get away with it.
Comment by Raine on 07/23/2009 13:41:01
Hey sleepy!
Raine on 07/23/2009 13:41:01
Quote by Random:
Random sleepy.
Comment by Random on 07/23/2009 13:41:16
...from my new fav quote from Linus. "What was that about?"
Random on 07/23/2009 13:41:16
Quote by Raine:
Is Sarah Drunk tweeting again?judge investigation,destroy integrity of process&strip rights;Abuse WILL cont til leaks/friv filers r held accntble&press reports accurately
12 minutes ago from TwitterBerry
:huh:
...from my new fav quote from Linus. "What was that about?"
Comment by Random on 07/23/2009 13:44:46
dun mock me...Random's back at work at a job that's gonna boot him out in two weeks...He's incredibly depressed...and he's listening to how the Health Care shit isn't working...he's got a right to be...
why am I being pissy?
I'm sleepy...I think my satire turned into real annoyance for a moment...forgive me, I must be tired.
Random on 07/23/2009 13:44:46
Quote by Raine:Hey sleepy!Quote by Random:
Random sleepy.
dun mock me...Random's back at work at a job that's gonna boot him out in two weeks...He's incredibly depressed...and he's listening to how the Health Care shit isn't working...he's got a right to be...
why am I being pissy?
I'm sleepy...I think my satire turned into real annoyance for a moment...forgive me, I must be tired.
Comment by TriSec on 07/23/2009 13:45:23
TriSec on 07/23/2009 13:45:23
Hey Raine, you might want to cross-post a link back to the forum. There's some folks there who don't come to the blog that will certainly have an opinion about today's case study.
:peace:
:peace:
Comment by Raine on 07/23/2009 13:58:19
I am sorry if you percieved my comment to be mockery.
Raine on 07/23/2009 13:58:19
Quote by Random:
dun mock me...Random's back at work at a job that's gonna boot him out in two weeks...He's incredibly depressed...and he's listening to how the Health Care shit isn't working...he's got a right to be...
why am I being pissy?
I'm sleepy...I think my satire turned into real annoyance for a moment...forgive me, I must be tired.
I am sorry if you percieved my comment to be mockery.
Comment by Random on 07/23/2009 13:58:41
Random on 07/23/2009 13:58:41
does that mean if you're a do it yourself Liberal, you live off the gummyment?
Comment by Random on 07/23/2009 14:01:47
ack...No. No. No. that is part that I'm apologizing for. (well, all of it) Random just...for some reason very annoyed at his day. HE didn't mean to take it out on you.
Random on 07/23/2009 14:01:47
Quote by Raine:Quote by Random:
dun mock me...Random's back at work at a job that's gonna boot him out in two weeks...He's incredibly depressed...and he's listening to how the Health Care shit isn't working...he's got a right to be...
why am I being pissy?
I'm sleepy...I think my satire turned into real annoyance for a moment...forgive me, I must be tired.
I am sorry if you percieved my comment to be mockery.
ack...No. No. No. that is part that I'm apologizing for. (well, all of it) Random just...for some reason very annoyed at his day. HE didn't mean to take it out on you.
Comment by Raine on 07/23/2009 14:10:26
Hey Scoop -- you may like this. If conservatives won't support Henry Louis Gates over a bullying cop, they're not conservative at all.
Raine on 07/23/2009 14:10:26
Quote by Scoopster:
Today I decided I'd see if they were still beating this dead horse and sure enough.. I might write a complaint letter to the station manager about the garbage they're spweing and asking why these idiots are even on their station when they don't stick to the damn format.
Comment by Raine on 07/23/2009 14:10:41
Raine on 07/23/2009 14:10:41
Rebekah!
Comment by Scoopster on 07/23/2009 14:12:17
Scoopster on 07/23/2009 14:12:17
Comment by Scoopster on 07/23/2009 14:13:33
Hahahaha that's awesome...
Scoopster on 07/23/2009 14:13:33
Quote by Raine:Hey Scoop -- you may like this. If conservatives won't support Henry Louis Gates over a bullying cop, they're not conservative at all.Quote by Scoopster:
Today I decided I'd see if they were still beating this dead horse and sure enough.. I might write a complaint letter to the station manager about the garbage they're spweing and asking why these idiots are even on their station when they don't stick to the damn format.
Hahahaha that's awesome...
Comment by Raine on 07/23/2009 14:20:23
Raine on 07/23/2009 14:20:23
One more thing about the Gates situation.
People are allowed to be "verbally combative" in their own home, especially when they are innocent of any crimes. Once the cop saw the Professor was upset the cop should have just left....he really had no business staying there once it was established there was no crime committed.
Personally I think, that if being verbally abusive is now a reason to arrest someone -- maybe we should start arresting the likes of Michael Savage and Rush Limbaugh.
People are allowed to be "verbally combative" in their own home, especially when they are innocent of any crimes. Once the cop saw the Professor was upset the cop should have just left....he really had no business staying there once it was established there was no crime committed.
Personally I think, that if being verbally abusive is now a reason to arrest someone -- maybe we should start arresting the likes of Michael Savage and Rush Limbaugh.
Comment by Raine on 07/23/2009 14:22:47
that said -- now you enter 1st Amendment issues.
Maybe if Gates just had a gun to defend himself instead of words....
Raine on 07/23/2009 14:22:47
Quote by Raine:
One more thing about the Gates situation.
People are allowed to be "verbally combative" in their own home, especially when they are innocent of any crimes. Once the cop saw the Professor was upset the cop should have just left....he really had no business staying there once it was established there was no crime committed.
Personally I think, that if being verbally abusive is now a reason to arrest someone -- maybe we should start arresting the likes of Michael Savage and Rush Limbaugh.
Maybe if Gates just had a gun to defend himself instead of words....
Comment by Scoopster on 07/23/2009 14:28:17
Scoopster on 07/23/2009 14:28:17
Watchdog group CREW suing the government for information about who's attended meetings with the Obama Administration regarding health care reform.
CREW are the good guys btw.. and this is a GREAT chance for Obama to show that he's not gonna run things like they were when Cheney's energy task force was around.
CREW are the good guys btw.. and this is a GREAT chance for Obama to show that he's not gonna run things like they were when Cheney's energy task force was around.
Comment by 
m-hadley on 07/23/2009 14:39:15
m-hadley on 07/23/2009 14:39:15
Morning Everybodee :coffee:
I am in a panic, trying to take care of all of the last minute details that need tending to before I head for DC at 6:00am tomorrow
Wish me luck - I'm gonna need it 
Mala, is there anyway/anytime we might be able to hook up? I'm going to a film (Alcatraz is not an Island) at 12:30 on Saturday at the National Museum of the American Indian - are you interested in meeting there? Please just let me know - everyone else: anybody want/need anything from DC (besides a sane Health Care Policy with a Public Option?)
Cheers,
mfaye & :peace:
I am in a panic, trying to take care of all of the last minute details that need tending to before I head for DC at 6:00am tomorrow
Wish me luck - I'm gonna need it Mala, is there anyway/anytime we might be able to hook up? I'm going to a film (Alcatraz is not an Island) at 12:30 on Saturday at the National Museum of the American Indian - are you interested in meeting there? Please just let me know - everyone else: anybody want/need anything from DC (besides a sane Health Care Policy with a Public Option?)Cheers,
mfaye
& :peace:
Comment by Raine on 07/23/2009 14:43:20
Raine on 07/23/2009 14:43:20
For the people who are all worried about the Illegals... Check it out.
More at the link.
It is just another crazy RW myth regarding healthcare.
Rep. Steve King’s Fudged Math Sets Off Alarm: ‘5,600,000 Illegal Aliens’ Covered By ‘Obamacare’
Rep. Steve King (R-IA) set off an alarm this morning, warning that the Congressional Budget Office (CBO) estimates indicate that 5,600,000 “illegal aliens” may be covered under “Obamacare.” King’s office didn’t do much number-crunching to come up with that big, scary figure. Instead, they relied on sheer inference to reach the nitwit conclusion that millions of undocumented immigrants will be covered by a health care bill that explicitly excludes them.
It is just another crazy RW myth regarding healthcare.
Comment by TriSec on 07/23/2009 14:49:28
Well, if you can find and photograph the "4F Inaugural Commemorative Plaque" left somewhere on the mall by the Washington Monument, that would be good.
Otherwise, just slap Harry Reid for me, willya?
TriSec on 07/23/2009 14:49:28
Quote by m-hadley:
everyone else: anybody want/need anything from DC (besides a sane Health Care Policy with a Public Option?)
Cheers,
mfaye
Well, if you can find and photograph the "4F Inaugural Commemorative Plaque" left somewhere on the mall by the Washington Monument, that would be good.
Otherwise, just slap Harry Reid for me, willya?
Comment by Random on 07/23/2009 15:00:45
Random on 07/23/2009 15:00:45
It's official...Random's Sold out on Twitter..purposefully putting things people will find in a search.
Comment by BobR on 07/23/2009 15:02:08
Actually, it kind of bothers me that people visiting our country - legally or illegally - will end up having to pay out the ass should they have a medical problem while they're here. As it is now, ER healthcare is costing us taxpayers a lot of money. It would be cheaper in tax dollars to go ahead and cover them.
BobR on 07/23/2009 15:02:08
Quote by Raine:
For the people who are all worried about the Illegals... Check it out.More at the link.Rep. Steve King’s Fudged Math Sets Off Alarm: ‘5,600,000 Illegal Aliens’ Covered By ‘Obamacare’
Rep. Steve King (R-IA) set off an alarm this morning, warning that the Congressional Budget Office (CBO) estimates indicate that 5,600,000 “illegal aliens” may be covered under “Obamacare.” King’s office didn’t do much number-crunching to come up with that big, scary figure. Instead, they relied on sheer inference to reach the nitwit conclusion that millions of undocumented immigrants will be covered by a health care bill that explicitly excludes them.
It is just another crazy RW myth regarding healthcare.
Actually, it kind of bothers me that people visiting our country - legally or illegally - will end up having to pay out the ass should they have a medical problem while they're here. As it is now, ER healthcare is costing us taxpayers a lot of money. It would be cheaper in tax dollars to go ahead and cover them.
Comment by Raine on 07/23/2009 15:17:13
Raine on 07/23/2009 15:17:13
Comment by Random on 07/23/2009 15:19:00
Random on 07/23/2009 15:19:00
It's official...when I finish this photo batch...I am out of the job...
Comment by Raine on 07/23/2009 15:22:15
Today?
:( Random you will find another gig....
Raine on 07/23/2009 15:22:15
Quote by Random:
It's official...when I finish this photo batch...I am out of the job...
:(
Random you will find another gig....
Comment by TriSec on 07/23/2009 15:25:43
It's one of those coincidental things, actually. The cop was indeed at Brandeis the day Reggie collapsed. Should just be a footnote; of course he's using it to show "Hey, I tried to save a black man once! I ain't no racist!"
TriSec on 07/23/2009 15:25:43
Quote by Raine:
How am I supposed to take this?
Gates arrest Cop says he tried to save Reggie Lewis.
It's one of those coincidental things, actually. The cop was indeed at Brandeis the day Reggie collapsed. Should just be a footnote; of course he's using it to show "Hey, I tried to save a black man once! I ain't no racist!"
Comment by Scoopster on 07/23/2009 15:39:04
That reminds me of the movie Crash..
Scoopster on 07/23/2009 15:39:04
Quote by TriSec:Quote by Raine:
How am I supposed to take this?
Gates arrest Cop says he tried to save Reggie Lewis.
It's one of those coincidental things, actually. The cop was indeed at Brandeis the day Reggie collapsed. Should just be a footnote; of course he's using it to show "Hey, I tried to save a black man once! I ain't no racist!"
That reminds me of the movie Crash..
Comment by BobR on 07/23/2009 15:45:56
"Some of my best friends are nigg... um... black!"
BobR on 07/23/2009 15:45:56
Quote by TriSec:Quote by Raine:
How am I supposed to take this?
Gates arrest Cop says he tried to save Reggie Lewis.
It's one of those coincidental things, actually. The cop was indeed at Brandeis the day Reggie collapsed. Should just be a footnote; of course he's using it to show "Hey, I tried to save a black man once! I ain't no racist!"
"Some of my best friends are nigg... um... black!"
Comment by Scoopster on 07/23/2009 16:06:09
Scoopster on 07/23/2009 16:06:09
Oh yeah.. I've got a super-secret update on the Parade Committee and the teabagger situation! 4F eyes only!!
I spoke with my landlord, who attended the recent committee meeting about this whole mess. Basically the pressure was put on by the town administrator (who lives down the street from me) to make nice with them and try to get the turd polished. So the committee and the town issued a joint statement saying that they weren't banned from the parade. My landlord was also not kicked off the committee despite the master teabagger's demands.
What wasn't said is the important part. The statement issued by the committee/town didn't apologize for my landlord's actions on their behalf, nor did it say that the claims of the tebaggers were correct. It just kinda skirted that whole part of the issue. Below the surface, the committee and the town is now reviewing all current parade policies with legal counsel to update everything and make it as legally binding as possible. Also, to address the claim that the teabagger float was singled out the rules will probably be more strictly enforced, and might possibly include police supervision and ejecting even politicians on foot who hand stuff out, no questions asked..
Finally, the teabaggers may not be banned outright, but who's to say that should they apply in the future that they won't just be denied entry into the parade on say.. technicalities??
I spoke with my landlord, who attended the recent committee meeting about this whole mess. Basically the pressure was put on by the town administrator (who lives down the street from me) to make nice with them and try to get the turd polished. So the committee and the town issued a joint statement saying that they weren't banned from the parade. My landlord was also not kicked off the committee despite the master teabagger's demands.
What wasn't said is the important part. The statement issued by the committee/town didn't apologize for my landlord's actions on their behalf, nor did it say that the claims of the tebaggers were correct. It just kinda skirted that whole part of the issue. Below the surface, the committee and the town is now reviewing all current parade policies with legal counsel to update everything and make it as legally binding as possible. Also, to address the claim that the teabagger float was singled out the rules will probably be more strictly enforced, and might possibly include police supervision and ejecting even politicians on foot who hand stuff out, no questions asked..
Finally, the teabaggers may not be banned outright, but who's to say that should they apply in the future that they won't just be denied entry into the parade on say.. technicalities??
Comment by 
livingonli on 07/23/2009 16:13:29
livingonli on 07/23/2009 16:13:29
A belated good day to everyone. I did not want to get up today but at least I got some decent sleep since I don't remember a thing since I went to bed last night
Great story, Raine. It does put a lot of this discussion into perspective and it's amazing that even black cops will treat other black people as suspects automatically No wonder why "Skip" Gates got so much shit from the cops
Great story, Raine. It does put a lot of this discussion into perspective and it's amazing that even black cops will treat other black people as suspects automatically No wonder why "Skip" Gates got so much shit from the cops
Comment by livingonli on 07/23/2009 16:20:49
Wouldn't those pro-second amendment righties say he has a right to defend himself and his property from government intrusion? :sarcasm:
livingonli on 07/23/2009 16:20:49
Quote by Raine:that said -- now you enter 1st Amendment issues.Quote by Raine:
One more thing about the Gates situation.
People are allowed to be "verbally combative" in their own home, especially when they are innocent of any crimes. Once the cop saw the Professor was upset the cop should have just left....he really had no business staying there once it was established there was no crime committed.
Personally I think, that if being verbally abusive is now a reason to arrest someone -- maybe we should start arresting the likes of Michael Savage and Rush Limbaugh.
Maybe if Gates just had a gun to defend himself instead of words....
Wouldn't those pro-second amendment righties say he has a right to defend himself and his property from government intrusion? :sarcasm:
Comment by Raine on 07/23/2009 17:00:00
Raine on 07/23/2009 17:00:00
Quote by livingonli:Quote by Raine:that said -- now you enter 1st Amendment issues.Quote by Raine:
One more thing about the Gates situation.
People are allowed to be "verbally combative" in their own home, especially when they are innocent of any crimes. Once the cop saw the Professor was upset the cop should have just left....he really had no business staying there once it was established there was no crime committed.
Personally I think, that if being verbally abusive is now a reason to arrest someone -- maybe we should start arresting the likes of Michael Savage and Rush Limbaugh.
Maybe if Gates just had a gun to defend himself instead of words....
Wouldn't those pro-second amendment righties say he has a right to defend himself and his property from government intrusion? :sarcasm:
Comment by 
velveeta jones on 07/23/2009 17:02:10
velveeta jones on 07/23/2009 17:02:10
Raine. That is one FUCKED UP story. I wonder what the hell was wrong with that trooper. And by the way, I would NEVER have paid the tow fee. Never.
Bastards.
Bastards.
Comment by 
Mondobubba on 07/23/2009 17:09:04
We need a little Sanford levity today.
Mondobubba on 07/23/2009 17:09:04
We need a little Sanford levity today.
Comment by Scoopster on 07/23/2009 17:23:10
Scoopster on 07/23/2009 17:23:10
Breaking Headline on cnn.com - Senate won’t vote on health care bill until after August, Majority Leader Harry Reid says.
:facepalm: fuckin' weak-kneed asshat.
:facepalm: fuckin' weak-kneed asshat.
Comment by Raine on 07/23/2009 17:28:50
I just read that myself. That really pisses me off. Nancy was ready to work thru the break.
What that means tho is when these folks are back in their states, it is time to callcallcallcallcallcall
Raine on 07/23/2009 17:28:50
Quote by Scoopster:
Breaking Headline on cnn.com - Senate won’t vote on health care bill until after August, Majority Leader Harry Reid says.
:facepalm: fuckin' weak-kneed asshat.
What that means tho is when these folks are back in their states, it is time to callcallcallcallcallcall
Comment by Raine on 07/23/2009 17:29:42
Fucked up indeed.
Raine on 07/23/2009 17:29:42
Quote by velveeta jones:
Raine. That is one FUCKED UP story. I wonder what the hell was wrong with that trooper. And by the way, I would NEVER have paid the tow fee. Never.
Bastards.
Fucked up indeed.
Comment by Mondobubba on 07/23/2009 17:34:29
Mondobubba on 07/23/2009 17:34:29
John Stewart on the birthers.
"...Congressman Campbell give one dollar tug jobs at a local rest stop." :rofl:
"...Congressman Campbell give one dollar tug jobs at a local rest stop." :rofl:
Comment by Raine on 07/23/2009 17:36:19
Raine on 07/23/2009 17:36:19
:rofl: Thom is so funny with the Pigeons and the 
Comment by Mondobubba on 07/23/2009 17:38:05
Mondobubba on 07/23/2009 17:38:05
Small favor, will you who are on Facebook go and comment on my dear, but retarded friend Don's comment about my status message. He needs a verbal beat down. Yes he is one of my closest friends, but he is being stupid.
Comment by livingonli on 07/23/2009 17:56:25
livingonli on 07/23/2009 17:56:25
You have to love the wacko callers on Thom's show. The poor, oppressed white man.