About Us
Mission Statement
Rules of Conduct
 
Name:
Pswd:
Remember Me
Register
 

Occupying the Discussion
Author: BobR    Date: 10/26/2011 12:42:40

As the original Occupy Wall Street protest passes through its 6th week, the ideals and actions have spread throughout the country and across the globe. From an original idea of separating the influence of Wall Street on politics, the list of "demands" (desires, really) have grown and morphed into a collection of ideals covering the realm of economic justice and fairness. They have stubbornly refused to declare leaders, which may or may not be a hinderence in achieving their goals. There's also a lack of direction in terms of achieving their goals as they claim to be loathe to embrace the political process. That may also be a hinderence.

Nonetheless, their message is ringing true to millions of Americans, who - despite working hard and doing what they were told was required to acheive the American Dream - find themselves one paycheck away from ruin. The Free Market policies and tax cuts for the rich have resulted in an upward migration of wealth to the 1% that the OWS protest has targeted. There is no shortage of wealth, it's just being held by a few people, and a lot of them are hoarding. That hurts the economy, because the money is not in motion.

For those that don't quite get that, the richest 1% have seen their incomes triple between 1997 and 2007. That's compared to the bottom 20% who saw their incomes increase by 18% and most average Americans who've seen their incomes increase by about 62%. 18% - 62% - 300%... That's a huge differential. Here's a graph showing the richest 1%'s share of total income through the years:

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/d/d7/2008_Top1percentUSA.png/320px-2008_Top1percentUSA.png

(source)

It clearly shows us returning to the "gilded age" prior to the great Wall St. crash and the Great Depression. From the 50s to the 80s, the tax rates on the rich were very high. Yet - there were still rich people who enjoyed their money, but there was also a strong middle class of people that worked regular jobs and were able to buy houses, cars, go on vacation... The high tax rates on the "job creators" did not prevent them from creating jobs. As we swing into another gilded age, the rich are richer than ever, enjoying record-low tax rates. Yet despite all their wealth, the unemployment rate is still high. As "job creators", they are doing a very poor job.

Most of the solutions to these problems (reinstating Glass-Steagle and/or other regulations on the financial industry, and raising taxes on the wealthiest) require action in Congress. The Republicans currently control Congress, so that is not likely to happen. President Obama can only do so much. One area of contention with OWS is the subject of student loans. This is something the president CAN act upon, and he is trying to accelerate a plan to cap max payments at 10% of income which was scheduled to go into effect in 2014:
Obama plans to accelerate a plan to cap student loan payments at 10 percent of income, bringing it forward to start in 2012 instead of 2014.
"Steps like these won't take the place of the bold action we need from Congress to boost our economy and create jobs, but they will make a difference," he said in a statement.

The loans initiative will be the third such move by Obama in as many days, following action to aid homeowners and boost hiring of military veterans. The White House wants to show he is an activist president battling a "do-nothing" Congress.

The loan changes do not require approval by Congress.

(in contrast - Ron Paul would rather that only rich kids get a college education)

As these protests have popped up in various cities, the local governments and police have taken different tacts in dealing with them. The protesters - most of whom are not actually homeless - are living as if they are. They are camped out in the urban landscape, and in some cases mingling with the local homeless. That has created an interesting synergy, as described in this excellent article in the Washington Post about the Occupy DC protest:
More than any other group in the District, the occupation movements are affecting many of the city’s estimated 6,500 homeless — most of whom sleep on the streets or in emergency shelters. Although protests are routine in the nation’s capital, it’s not every day that demonstrators rally in someone’s bedroom.

In growing numbers, the city’s homeless are embracing the 100-plus tents at Occupy D.C. in McPherson Square and the smaller Stop the Machine encampment at Freedom Plaza. With the Occupy Wall Street movements decrying what they labelcorporate greed, protesters said the stories behind the District’s homeless are emblematic of a political and economic system failing the lower class.

Although some of the homeless resent the newcomers’ claim on the park, many said the new neighbors are doing what city leaders have struggled to do for years. The protesters are raising awareness while boosting their quality of life by bringing a sense of security and community to an otherwise cruel existence, many of the homeless said.

“It’s a good cause, and I hope they are here for months,” said Lynwood Baylor, 64, who sleeps in a shelter but sits on a bench in McPherson Square during the day. “This is the first time I have seen so many people [at the park] for the same thing. There really is strength in numbers.”

I highly recommend reading the article, as it provides a LOT of food for thought. There was one quote, though, that stood out:
“How do you tell the difference between homeless and protester?” asked Lt. Mike Libby of the U.S. Park Police

Why does it matter? They want to be able to arrest protesters, but not the homeless? On what grounds? The protesters are essentially doing the same thing as the homeless.

That aspect of it created a much nastier scene in Atlanta, where camping in public parks is prohibited by law. The police arrested anyone who remained in the park, including the homeless. The Occupy Atlanta protesters had pre-arranged for bail, but the homeless were not so lucky (FYI - the article at the link changes, so I am loathe to quote from it). Other cities have seen similar police crackdowns, but it's not clear how many innocent people are getting swept up in the over-reactions. It's been well-reported that at least one CitiBank customer was arrested in New York when she was in the bank at the same time as OWS protesters going there to close out their accounts. Other cities have seen SWAT teams using brutal tactics to clear protest areas.

The tension is clearly building, as city governments are trying to understand how to deal with protests that aren't started and ended over a day or weekend. Cities have tried to be humanitarian with the homeless, but as this movement grows of people willfully being homeless in an effort to petition the government with their grievances, the government is unable to ignore them, and their frustration is spilling over into fascist-type suppression, which only serves to make the message ever more clear.

Perhaps that's the point I've been missing about all this: We will not be ignored. We will not be dismissed. We will be heard.

And perhaps that alone will result in action by those in government with the power to make change. If not, I fear that a lyric from Jesus Christ Superstar will come true:

Why waste your breath moaning at the crowd?
Nothing can be done to stop the shouting,
If ev'ry tongue was still, the noise would still continue,
The rocks and stones themselves would start to sing

 

41 comments (Latest Comment: 10/27/2011 01:38:40 by wickedpam)
   Perma Link

Share This!

Furl it!
Spurl
NewsVine
Reddit
Technorati

Add a Comment

Please login to add a comment...


Comments:

Order comments Newest to Oldest  Refresh Comments

Comment by TriSec on 10/26/2011 13:10:34
Breaking on the BBC World Service right now. Mmm.....this could be major.



Comment by Raine on 10/26/2011 13:18:32
Quote by TriSec:
Breaking on the BBC World Service right now. Mmm.....this could be major.

After what Karzai said, I can't really say this surprises me. IT is very disturbing.


Comment by Raine on 10/26/2011 13:23:11
good morning!

Comment by TriSec on 10/26/2011 13:30:14
The problem with morning is that it happens in the morning.



Comment by wickedpam on 10/26/2011 13:37:12
Morning

Still no internet or phones at the office. Just doing a phoneby

Comment by trojanrabbit on 10/26/2011 13:39:00
Morning all

No news on the Mrs. Rabbit front really. No change in amount of pain, though it's moving. Had an MRI yesterday. Will have a bone scan tomorrow, then we see her orthopedic surgeon Monday. I think they're looking at back/nerve issues.

I've "decorated" my cube with lights and I programmed them to do orange patterns. That's the extent of my Halloween participation. I'm not into dressing up. Bad memories. Mrs. Rabbit's car accident that is the source of her knee problems (and probably this) was on Halloween. We lost Buddy on Halloween.



Comment by Scoopster on 10/26/2011 13:39:00
Morning all.. It's Humpdee!

The wackadoodle ads from Herman Cain keep coming.



Comment by Raine on 10/26/2011 13:41:05

"I'm going to wait until everybody's voted off the island. Once they narrow it down to one or two, I'll start paying attention."

President Obama, on why he doesn't watch the GOP debates.

Comment by Raine on 10/26/2011 13:42:25
Quote by trojanrabbit:
Morning all

No news on the Mrs. Rabbit front really. No change in amount of pain, though it's moving. Had an MRI yesterday. Will have a bone scan tomorrow, then we see her orthopedic surgeon Monday. I think they're looking at back/nerve issues.

I've "decorated" my cube with lights and I programmed them to do orange patterns. That's the extent of my Halloween participation. I'm not into dressing up. Bad memories. Mrs. Rabbit's car accident that is the source of her knee problems (and probably this) was on Halloween. We lost Buddy on Halloween.



I hope they find what is going on and it is easily treatable, Rabbit.


Comment by TriSec on 10/26/2011 14:04:19
Elizabeth Warren also invented the internet.


In an interview published yesterday on the Daily Beast website, Warren took her most aggressively supportive tone to date, claiming substantial credit for the writings and views that Occupy Wall Street protests have amplified across the country.

“I created much of the intellectual foundation for what they do,’’ she told the website. “I support what they do.’’


I've already heard rumblings from our differently-winged friends taking potshots.


Comment by Mondobubba on 10/26/2011 14:06:23
Quote by Raine:

"I'm going to wait until everybody's voted off the island. Once they narrow it down to one or two, I'll start paying attention."

President Obama, on why he doesn't watch the GOP debates.



I agree with that.

Comment by trojanrabbit on 10/26/2011 14:06:40
Quote by Raine:

"I'm going to wait until everybody's voted off the island. Once they narrow it down to one or two, I'll start paying attention."

President Obama, on why he doesn't watch the GOP debates.


Sounds about right, treat it like the "reality show" that it is. Hopefully the debates turn into a "circular firing squad"

Comment by Mondobubba on 10/26/2011 14:08:23
Quote by TriSec:
Breaking on the BBC World Service right now. Mmm.....this could be major.




This isn't any suprise to me at all. INI has been playing both sides against the middle for as long as there has been the Taliban.

Comment by trojanrabbit on 10/26/2011 14:12:04
Quote by TriSec:
Elizabeth Warren also invented the internet.


In an interview published yesterday on the Daily Beast website, Warren took her most aggressively supportive tone to date, claiming substantial credit for the writings and views that Occupy Wall Street protests have amplified across the country.

“I created much of the intellectual foundation for what they do,’’ she told the website. “I support what they do.’’


I've already heard rumblings from our differently-winged friends taking potshots.


This is the first time I've heard The Daily Beast mentioned on a more mainstream media outlet (WBZ radio / CBS). Am I getting my propaganda sources mixed up? Which one is Glenn Beck's mouthpiece?

Comment by BobR on 10/26/2011 14:42:40
Quote by trojanrabbit:
Quote by Raine:

"I'm going to wait until everybody's voted off the island. Once they narrow it down to one or two, I'll start paying attention."

President Obama, on why he doesn't watch the GOP debates.


Sounds about right, treat it like the "reality show" that it is. Hopefully the debates turn into a "circular firing squad"

I assume his staffers are watching and taking notes for future ammunition

Comment by Raine on 10/26/2011 14:43:04
Ok, This guy is a typical dick. File it under NOT HELPING
News from Occupy Atlanta:
One immediate change protesters wanted was to distance themselves from a man in the crowd holding a loaded AK-47 rifle.

"We have nothing to do with this. We did our job and informed police and police are watching," Ron Allen with Occupy Atlanta said.

The man told Stouffer his name was Porch and it was completely legal to walk around with his gun.

Porch told Stouffer he was there, "to support the people that deserve to be in the park. They shouldn't be thrown out for peacefully protesting. They've got a right to be here just like anybody else."

One protester said, "That's sabotaging the message, we're nonviolent."


Yeah, he's there to support the protestors, riiiiight.

Comment by Raine on 10/26/2011 14:53:18
and the AJC, always known for it spectacular reporting...

What is happening he
Atlanta police recruits, dressed in white T-shirts and blue pants, first began erecting the barricades Monday afternoon after Reed said he would at some point rescind his order allowing the protesters to remain in the park until Nov. 7. The mayor said an unauthorized hip-hop concert that created a "dangerous situation" was the reason, adding some people associated with the movement "were on a clear path to escalation."

In response, Occupy Atlanta said city officials had "fabricated danger where none exists."

It became clear around 8 p.m. Tuesday that arrests were imminent. Officers blocked off Park Place NE alongside Woodruff Park as about 50 additional officers arrived on the scene.

At 10:45 p.m Tuesday, Franzen told participants who were willing to be arrested to gather in a circle in the middle of the park. He advised those who had been drinking, using drugs or were on probation not to take part and asked demonstrators outside the park to return at 6 a.m.

Franzen said arrangements already had been made to cover the bail of group members who were arrested. The 53 protesters were taken to the Atlanta City Detention Center and charged with violating a city ordinance, a misdemeanor.
Those arrested were put into 3 categories:

The courthouse was briefly evacuated just before 10 a.m. when fire alarms sounded. Officials began evacuating the building but then said it was a false alarm and everyone returned to the building.

Nine lawyers representing the protesters were meeting with Judge Crystal Gaines. A lawyer leaving the meeting told reporters that after background checks were completed the defendants would be divided into three groups for hearings: those who had outstanding arrest warrants and would not be eligible for bail; those who were homeless and would not be able to post bail; and all the others.
This is getting ridiculous. What is happening here is that some in the media and officials are trying to paint these protests as violent. Take a look at Occupy Oakland

Comment by Raine on 10/26/2011 16:36:39

This is starting to get silly.

(not the protesters -- the RW trying to play such silly games.)

Comment by livingonli on 10/26/2011 16:37:12
Good day everyone. Just hanging low and lazy today.

Comment by Al from WV on 10/26/2011 16:41:47
Annual/Semi-annual stop by to say hi.

Still found at [email protected].

Hope all are well. Rabbit, prayers for Mrs. Rabbit (shouldn't that be "Ms" Rabbit?) as regards physical condition, and for you both as regards tough memories.

Somebody ask Velveeta to email me, please. Just want to be sure she's ok. Been a LONG time since I've heard from her.

Thanks, and be well.

Al

Comment by Raine on 10/26/2011 16:42:17
So, I am a memeber of a group tha tis supposed to have all political POV's welcomed. (I don;t really like the group, I just find it easier to see the RW memes from there)

So Some dude posts a picture of the anti-Semite guy on Wall Street (the one who has been there for many years) and says that is proof that the movement is anti semite -- compares it somehow to the holocaust, I called him out on it, then he assumed that I think he is a bigot (projection)

then he goes on to say that OCCUPY is funded by... wait for it...






BIG GOVERNMENT.





Comment by Raine on 10/26/2011 16:43:10
Quote by Al from WV:
Annual/Semi-annual stop by to say hi.

Still found at [email protected].

Hope all are well. Rabbit, prayers for Mrs. Rabbit (shouldn't that be "Ms" Rabbit?) as regards physical condition, and for you both as regards tough memories.

Somebody ask Velveeta to email me, please. Just want to be sure she's ok. Been a LONG time since I've heard from her.

Thanks, and be well.

Al

AL!

I'll make sure she gets your message!

Comment by TriSec on 10/26/2011 16:47:36
Al, ya big lug!

Come on, you can always visit here. I still bite, but my shots are up-to-date.


A couple of "occupy" notes...

I heard the anti-semite angle for the first time last night. The normally aloof and non-aligned Dan Rea (of Nightside fame, WBZ 1030am) had a Tea Party dude on the other night and they were both spouting talking points. (Something Dan never does.) When he started quoting Glenn Beck, I had to turn it off. I'm afraid that move cost him a good deal of respect from me.





Comment by Raine on 10/26/2011 17:08:52
Quote by TriSec:I heard the anti-semite angle for the first time last night. The normally aloof and non-aligned Dan Rea (of Nightside fame, WBZ 1030am) had a Tea Party dude on the other night and they were both spouting talking points. (Something Dan never does.) When he started quoting Glenn Beck, I had to turn it off. I'm afraid that move cost him a good deal of respect from me.



It's a dude that has been around Wall Street for years -- he is one of those crazies that has frequented the streets of the city.

Think of those *end of the world* types...

Here, read this.


TPM and Think progress were on this one last week.

Comment by TriSec on 10/26/2011 17:12:42
Non-sequitir:

This whole Theo vs. Sux vs. Shlubs thingy...

Given:

1. Theo broke his contract with the Red Sox
2. He's got a promotion and better title with the Cubs

Therefore:

1. The Cubs should pay the Red Sox the cash equivalent of Theo's last year
2. Because Theo broke the contract, he should have to pay back a cash penalty of some sort.
3. Ford should issue a pardon so we can put this long national nightmare behind us.

Sheesh.



Comment by BobR on 10/26/2011 17:15:17
blog is posted. Sorry for the long delay.

Comment by Raine on 10/26/2011 17:16:39
Apostle to the Mohawks: Pat Buchanan

Shaking my head. Is he comparing himself to a martyr?

Comment by Raine on 10/26/2011 17:21:00
Amazing post, Bob. Well worth the wait.


Comment by Al from WV on 10/26/2011 17:36:56
Better for my BP if I don't visit or read often, Tri, on this or any other political site. Ergo, I don't. It would only get me damned upset, in an environment where not only would what I believe in not be adopted, it would not be taken seriously. I mean no offense. Good people here, I know that and have for a long time. Merely not an area of life that I think I can do one damned thing about. No sense in letting it affect me.

Since I quit political boards I have:
1. lost 60 pounds on purpose, and I'm headed for a total loss in the range of 115 pounds,
2. stabilized my BP at about 120-116 / 72-66,
3. become able to walk more than a hundred yards without sweating like a work horse (up to more than about a mile, now),
4. for all practical intents and purposes, adopted a teenager who was adopted out of Russan orphanages at 8 years old who has now been rejected by her adoptive US parents (she's 17 now)
and,
5. taken on about 10 informal "clients" (whose personal proclivities are not widely accepted, while they are equally not illegal or morally wrong) as a sort of an ad hoc life coach.

I've thought about a gazillion times that I'd start my old blog back up, if that's the right term, although it never really got started much in the first place, but then it would lean political, and I won't go there. It's not worth it anymore. Everybody I know or know of is all about parties, and winning, and making this or that or the other change in public policy. I'm about believing well, believing honorably, believing morally, and seeing where the chips fall from that. The two do not mix, Tri.

I do, however, GREATLY appreciate your enthusiasm in your comments. Thank you, my old friend, very much.

Al


Comment by Scoopster on 10/26/2011 18:15:54
Oh for fuck's sake..

Even if it was true, SO FUCKING WHAT?! The cocksuckers at Fox News wish they performed a service to this country like ACORN does/did.

Comment by Scoopster on 10/26/2011 18:37:55
Heads up btw.. Rawstory's been hacked so if you go there don't click on anything.

Comment by Scoopster on 10/26/2011 18:53:20
Fucking CNN...

http://images.bluegartr.com/bucket/gallery/a3fb281a43cd313e389ac1d4b2d28adc.PNG


Comment by Raine on 10/26/2011 20:10:26
OK, all my items for my costume have been procured...


Comment by Raine on 10/26/2011 21:08:10
Comment by Raine on 10/26/2011 21:38:11
What may have gone under the radar is that the Albany NY police department have defied the mayor and the governors order to remove the protesters.

Comment by Raine on 10/26/2011 22:27:30
Ok guys -- see y'all later!

Comment by Will in Chicago on 10/27/2011 00:02:58
My best to Mrs. Rabbit -- I hope that all will be well.

Al, it is good to see you and hear that things are going well. That young woman is lucky to have you as a father figure.

As for myself, I have been going non stop since last Monday -- subbing, my mediation skills course and other stuff -- but I should have some time off the next few days.

Comment by clintster on 10/27/2011 00:38:39
http://l-userpic.livejournal.com/104857041/11965346


Comment by Raine on 10/27/2011 01:28:17
Quote by clintster:
http://l-userpic.livejournal.com/104857041/11965346



Comment by wickedpam on 10/27/2011 01:38:40
OMG! Its been so lonely without my work internet!!!!!!!!! Then there was our annual board meeting - which thank God was not crazy this year. And now I'm finally reconnected with the world!



And AL!!!!!! Sounds like you've got some great stuff going on!